85Mbps/45Mbps VDSL2 Down Under - iiNet starts tinkering with MDU VDSL2
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85Mbps/45Mbps VDSL2 Down Under
iiNet starts tinkering with MDU VDSL2
(old news - 10:32AM Friday Dec 19 2008)
tags: business · alternatives · bandwidth · world · networking
Earlier this week we noted that AT&T's plan for VDSL2 line bonding, aimed at offering faster DSL speeds at longer loop lengths, appears to have slipped into 2009, despite AT&T insisting a 2008 start just a few months earlier. It's not AT&T's fault -- apparently there have problems with bonded VDSL2 modem chipsets, resulting in a hardware delay. In Australia, iiNet says they've hit speeds of 85Mbps/45Mbps (via Engadget HD), not through bonding but by installing "mini-exchanges" in multi-dwelling units (aka apartment complexes).

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wifi4milez @ 19th Dec 10:39AM:
Same as MDU FIOS deployments?

Isnt this how they are delivering FIOS to MDU's here in NYC? MY understanding was that it was VDSL2 from a cabinet on each floor (or in the basement depending on the size of the building), however I am having trouble confirming this. My FIOS install is tomorrow however, so I will be able to sort out the mystery once and for all!
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Karl Bode @ 19th Dec 10:43AM:
Re: Same as MDU FIOS deployments?

Someone will surely correct me, but I believe you're right. Or at least that was how they were doing it before they started using bendable fiber. You might now be getting the new, good stuff:

video:

»media.corning.com/video/opticalf···300k.wmv
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wifi4milez @ 19th Dec 10:48AM:
Re: Same as MDU FIOS deployments?

said by Karl Bode :

Someone will surely correct me, but I believe you're right. Or at least that was how they were doing it before they started using bendable fiber....
I know for a fact that there is some sort of FIOS equipment installed in a utility closet on my floor. The question is will they run a fiber drop from there to my apartment and install an ONT, or will they run it via VDSL2 (or even coax) from there to me. I havent been able to access the closet to see what they have installed there, and nobody (on these forums) seems to know how these new installs will be done. I will report back and post some pics tomorrow at the following link (when its all done) for those who are curious.
»[northeast] Just ordered my FIOS!
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Ignite @ 19th Dec 11:30AM:
Made In Japan

Interestingly Japan have been doing this for a while - fibre to the MDU then VDSL onwards. I think these were hitting close to 100Mbit with non-standard VDSL.
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NoVaVoiper @ 19th Dec 11:52AM:
Re: Same as MDU FIOS deployments?

The older MDU installations place the ONT in the utility closet. Fiber runs to the ONT. Data runs to the unit over VDSL2. Video runs to the unit over coax.

If they have not run fiber to the unit yet, they would not do so on the day of the install, as it requires a massive effort and they would almost certainly do all the units at once. Since this is difficult in existing condominium buildings, most generally use the VDSL setup.

With my setup I can watch an HD VOD movie plus get 20/5 Internet simultaneously. Note, this was not working properly for a long time until a phone tech (former DSL tech) realized something was wrong with my DSL config. The new FiOS techs who never worked with DSL were stumped.
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kilometers @ 19th Dec 01:16PM:
Surewest needs to use this

They passed over my MDU community when they were running fiber to everyone else and all I could get was ADSL through them. I want the 20/20 speeds and HDTV service all the homes get in my area. =(
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ja2007123 @ 19th Dec 02:19PM:
Re: Made In Japan

Isn't Japan much smaller and technology advanced than the US?
Its obvious, they should have fiber in every home by now.
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wifi4milez @ 19th Dec 04:46PM:
Re: Same as MDU FIOS deployments?

said by NoVaVoiper :

The older MDU installations place the ONT in the utility closet. Fiber runs to the ONT. Data runs to the unit over VDSL2. Video runs to the unit over coax.

If they have not run fiber to the unit yet, they would not do so on the day of the install, as it requires a massive effort and they would almost certainly do all the units at once. Since this is difficult in existing condominium buildings, most generally use the VDSL setup.
My building is a brand new deployment, they just ran the fiber about three weeks ago. My understanding is that they ran fiber to the utility closet on each floor, so we will see what happens tomorrow.
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hwobu @ 8th Feb 10:03AM:
Clarification

Karl,

I've got good news for you, there is a correct and valid industry term for what you're calling a 'mini-exchange' on VDSL. That term is DSLAM (DSL Access Module). Coincidentally this equipment is identical regardless of where it has been physically located (sized based upon cost effectiveness).

Now for some tech-talk.

A DSLAM simply provides a DSL down-stream connection to subscribers, that DSLAM is in turn supplied connectivity through an up-stream (or back-haul) connection.

The down stream connections can be almost any DSL technology, and in some cases even a few connections that aren't really DSL. This is almost always exclusively dependent upon the specific line card inserted into the DSLAM. As for the up-stream connection, there are 4 main link types and the preference for one over another is highly dependent upon site bandwidth needs. Those uplink choices are IMA (inverse multiplexed ATM)(low bandwidth needs/few customers), Single DS3 (moderate bandwidth needs for a single DSLAM), SONET (OC-3 specifically) (higher bandwidth needs for 1 or 2 DSLAMs max, but still not enough density to need a local router), and lastly Gigabit Ethernet (this usually connects to a local edge router that may have 1 or more upstream connections and almost always serves more than one DSLAM at that site if not other equipment).

More detail about the downstream technologies available on a DSLAM.

(US specs here as speeds/specs vary widely from country to country)
[IDSL] - not very common (DSL over ISDN BRI) 128k or 144k max up and down, good distance
[ADSL] - most common consumer/residential delivery (moderate upload, much faster download vs upload 8:1 ratio normal) moderate to long distance, though there is a speed penalty at longer distances
[G.lite] - very similar to normal ADSL except line filters aren't required at the phones in exchange for slightly slower up/down speeds and shorter available distance from DSLAM (less prone to users forgetting a filter or plugging them in backwards)
[SDSL] - primarily business use, not very widely deployed
[HDSL] - almost exclusively business service delivery (indirectly) very common deployment technology for Business T1 service (aka 2wire T1) - technically this can support higher speeds than T1, though rarely used outside of that role
[ADSL2] - improved/updated version of ADSL, slightly better upload speed, much better download speed, slightly better distance - Bonding possible
[VDSL] - very good up and download speeds, but at a very short distance - resulted in this technology making it little past the prototype and early deployment stages
[VDSL2] - very high up/down speed connectivity over short distances and just high speed at moderate distances, sharp speed drop thereafter - Bonding possible
[SHDSL] - same up/down speed - very limited deployment till its modified application to long-haul-ethernet (2baseTL)
[2baseTL] - specialized DSLAMs required - bonded pairs, and up to 45Mb possible up/down over short distances and tapering off of around 7Mb at 13k feet (maximum speeds and distances require bonding)

For all of the downstream DSL connections, this involves one or more copper pairs (depending on specific DSL technology).

I hope this helps clear up some of the mysteries behind this technology.

Thomas
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hwobu @ 8th Feb 10:30AM:
Re: Clarification

-------correction on [VDSL]

Limited deployment for CLECs due to distance issues, RBOCs and LECs and ILECs have enjoyed slightly more success.
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