Bits Of ACTA Agreement Leaking Out - EFF says it's everything they feared...
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Bits Of ACTA Agreement Leaking Out
EFF says it's everything they feared...
09:06AM Wednesday Nov 04 2009 by Karl Bode
tags: legal · business · world · content
Remember the ACTA? The international anti-piracy agreement being hashed out in private between governments and the entertainment industry? The one the EFF sued to try and get information about but the Obama Administration classified as a state secret? Canadian Law Professor Michael Geist says bits and pieces are leaking out, and the law does indeed revolve around forcing ISPs into the role of Internet copyright nannies -- an expensive and likely futile endeavor. According to the EFF, the ACTA is everything they feared it would be: The safe harbors in the US Copyright law require ISPs to adopt and reasonably implement a policy for termination of "repeat infringers" "in appropriate circumstances". US law currently gives ISPs considerable flexibility to determine what are "appropriate circumstances" justifying the termination of a customer's Internet account. If the leak reports are correct, this would no longer be true. Instead, ISPs would be required to automatically terminate a customer upon a rightsholders' repeat allegation of copyright infringement at a particular IP address. According to the EFF, the new trade agreement would expose ISPs to third party liability for failing to terminate the broadband accounts of customers who trade in pirated files -- obviously taking the idea of "three strikes" globally with force. The laws have numerous other problems explained by the EFF, including taking our rather dysfunctional DMCA policies and making them the global gold standard. Again, it's important to keep in mind that this is all something the public and independent experts have been given no ability to give input on. "There is simply no reason for ACTA, at all," chimes in Mike Masnick at Techdirt. "It is nothing but an attempt by the entertainment industry to put massive restrictions on the internet, place liability on lots of third parties, and do nothing to push themselves to adapt to a changing marketplace with new business models."
Related:- Swiss Bank, CA Court Censor Whistleblower Website
- Malaysia Orders ISPs To Block Critical Blogs
- Brit Censors Back Off Wikipedia Ban
- 'Three Strikes' Debate A Global Affair
- French ISPs: Playing Copyright Cop Is Expensive
- Wikileaks Raided By German Police
- Music Industry Wants ISPs To Adhere To Nonexistent Laws
- Verizon Also Sending Letters On Behalf Of MPAA
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Time @ 4th Nov 09:12AM:
Classification
The one the EFF sued to try and get information about but the Obama Administration classified as a state secret?
How's that CHANGE and transparency working out for you?
--
"If it can't be done with brains, it can't be done with hours" - Clarence "Kelly" Johnson
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axus @ 4th Nov 09:15AM:
Stupid regulations
I don't think network neutrality rules that stop ISPs from buying expensive packet discrimination technology are excessive regulation. Surely, a better example of overblown regulation is requiring ISPs to monitor customers, stop doing business with them, and blacklist them from starting a new contract.
Here's hoping that we at least see who votes to ratify ACTA.
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Rob @ 4th Nov 09:33AM:
Re: Classification
said by Time :The one the EFF sued to try and get information about but the Obama Administration classified as a state secret?
How's that CHANGE and transparency working out for you?
I think you misunderstood. The transparency only exists when it has to do with documents that the Bush administration refused to release :D
--
CheckSite.us | YourIP.us | Reverseip.us
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TK Junk Mail @ 4th Nov 09:34AM:
Amerika
...government of the corporations, by the corporations, for the corporations.
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dynodb @ 4th Nov 09:39AM:
New business models?
"There is simply no reason for ACTA, at all," chimes in Mike Masnick at Techdirt. "It is nothing but an attempt by the entertainment industry to put massive restrictions on the internet, place liability on lots of third parties, and do nothing to push themselves to adapt to a changing marketplace with new business models."
"
I understand the objections... but exactly what kind of "business models" can compete with "free"?
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Kearnstd @ 4th Nov 09:40AM:
Re: Classification
someone needs to leak this full document on the net, wouldnt be the first time and this one getting leaked would cause no harm because it's not like its the design for a new spyplane or something important to keep hush hush.
--
[65 Arcanist]Filan(High Elf) Zone: Broadband Reports
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Selenia @ 4th Nov 09:43AM:
Re: Amerika
said by TK Junk Mail :
...government of the corporations, by the corporations, for the corporations.
If he's complaining about that, then this is not the real TK LOL. Well, this just reflects America's usual world police role and Obama's move to socialism. Secret laws made by way of secret meetings by the socialist party that people have no vote on or even knowledge of. Sound familiar? While certain socialism elements aren't horrible, this defeats the entire way the government is supposed to be run according to our current process. Who does he think he is overriding the voters part of the process? George W. Bush?
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anon @ 4th Nov 09:46AM:
Danger Will Robinson
People need to understand how dangerous this is. This will be a "international treaty" which means it completely supersedes any US law (net neutrality, privacy, etc.) In many circumstances treaty law even supersedes the US Constitution.
As a bonus, it only needs to be signed by the President and approved by the Senate. The House of Representatives has no say, and the US Courts have no jurisdiction. You are already seeing one of the advantages of "treaty law" as opposed to "legislative law" Treaty negotiations can be done completely in secret with no disclosure rules, no Freedom of Information requests, etc. Something that is very different from legislative deliberations.
This is an end run around our democratic system of government and citizen rights protected by the courts. A brilliant maneuver by the RIAA, if you ask me.
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funchords @ 4th Nov 09:46AM:
Re: New business models?
said by dynodb :
I understand the objections... but exactly what kind of "business models" can compete with "free"?
I dunno, let me go grab a bottled water and think about it...
--
Robb Topolski -= funchords.com =- District of Columbia -- KJ7RL
Test your Broadband connection today! -- »measurementlab.net/
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funchords @ 4th Nov 09:49AM:
Re: Amerika
ACTA, its agenda, and its secrecy all pre-dates Obama by a very long time.
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travelguy @ 4th Nov 09:52AM:
Re: New business models?
said by funchords :said by dynodb :
I understand the objections... but exactly what kind of "business models" can compete with "free"?
I dunno, let me go grab a bottled water and think about it...
Brilliant. Should get award for post of the week.
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SLD @ 4th Nov 09:57AM:
Re: Amerika
As usual, entities that have *no* voting power are getting *all* of the representation. Hmmmm, maybe it is time to redefine corporations???
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knightmb @ 4th Nov 10:16AM:
Re: Classification
said by Time :The one the EFF sued to try and get information about but the Obama Administration classified as a state secret?
How's that CHANGE and transparency working out for you?
LOL, you guys/gals crack me up.
I would just like to point out that everyone is getting their information from a single place: Michael Geist's blog. So where is this "leaked document"? Every source I find online points back to Geist. Even the articles Geist cites at the bottom of his blog point back to him. Even Wikipedia points back to him. I'm not saying that he's wrong nor am I trying to deflate the severity of this but Geist is even relying on other sources:
quote:
Sources say that the draft text, modeled on the U.S.-South Korea free trade agreement, focuses on following five issues...
Then following that even he says:
quote:
If accurate ...
Doesn't leave me a whole lot of confidence that we're getting all the facts here. I would seek information better than third or fourth hand accounts of something before I went around screaming about the sky falling.
quote:
Secret Copyright Treaty Leaks. It's Bad. Very Bad.
So where is the leaked document so that I can judge for myself?
--
Fight Insight Ready (Was NebuAD) and the like:
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Simba7 @ 4th Nov 10:17AM:
Re: Danger Will Robinson
Yep. The MPAA/RIAA will be in control of everything and it'll be the end of the internet as we know it. As far as the MPAA/RIAA is concerned, dialup was perfect for everyone.
Looks like I'll be putting my ol' BBS back together really soon.
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Simba7 @ 4th Nov 10:18AM:
Re: Classification
You honestly think if everyone knew of this that they'd approve?
I'm sure we'd have a cyber-equivalent of a Civil War.
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Transmaster @ 4th Nov 10:19AM:
Re: Danger Will Robinson
At last somebody gets it. If the RIAA had it's way we would still be forced to purchase 45's. and anything thing that could record anything would be banned or taxed with the proceeds going to the recording industry. We are dealing with an industry that rips-off it's contractors, they are not called musicians, is corrupt, and has behavior not unlike organized crime this is their SOP and has been their SOP more then 60 years.
I wonder how they are going to control the mail when we start to mail blueray CD's with 30 or more gig's of music on them to each other, oh of course they will want a tax on these disks.
--
I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man's reasoning powers are not above the monkey's.
- Mark Twain in Eruption
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NOCMan @ 4th Nov 10:22AM:
Re: Amerika
Saw this the other day in response to some glenn beck crap, but I liked it.
This morning I was awoken by my alarm clock powered by electricity
generated by the public power monopoly regulated by the US Department
of Energy.
I then took a shower in the clean water provided by the municipal water utility.
After that, I turned on the TV to one of the FCC regulated channels to
see what the National Weather Service of the National Oceanographic
and Atmospheric Administration determined the weather was going to be
like using satellites designed, built, and launched by the National
Aeronautics and Space Administration. I watched this while eating my
breakfast of US Department of Agriculture inspected food and taking
the drugs which have been determined as safe by the Food and Drug
Administration.
At the appropriate time as regulated by the US Congress and kept
accurate by the National Institute of Standards and Technology and the
US Naval Observatory, I get into my National Highway Traffic Safety
Administration approved automobile and set out to work on the roads
built by the local, state, and federal Departments of Transportation,
possibly stopping to purchase additional fuel of a quality level
determined by the Environmental Protection Agency, using legal tender
issued by the Federal Reserve Bank. On the way out the door I deposit
any mail I have to be sent out via the US Postal Service and drop the
kids off at the public school.
Then, after spending another day not being maimed or killed at work
thanks to the workplace regulations imposed by the Department of Labor
and the Occupational Safety and Health Administration, I drive back to
my house which has not burned down in my absence because of the state
and local building codes and the fire marshal's inspection, and which
has not been plundered of all its valuables thanks to the local police
department.
I then log onto the Internet which was developed by the Defense
Advanced Research Projects Administration and post on dslreports and
fox news forums about how SOCIALISM in medicine is BAD because the
government can't do anything right.
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jester121 @ 4th Nov 10:28AM:
Re: New business models?
said by travelguy :said by funchords :said by dynodb :
I understand the objections... but exactly what kind of "business models" can compete with "free"?
I dunno, let me go grab a bottled water and think about it...
Brilliant. Should get award for post of the week.
Not really -- a better analogy would be "Let me go get a handful of water from a mud puddle in the street." That water is truly "free".
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Mr Matt @ 4th Nov 10:32AM:
Capital offense if your Wireless Network is hacked.
:o Will the copyright weasels pay off enough lawmakers to make it a capital offense if copyrighted material is downloaded through your wireless network after it is hacked? Our government has a history of requiring individuals and corporations to do work for them and not reimburse them for the cost incurred. Tax laws require companies and banks to maintain a work force and/or computer systems to report employees or depositors income.
I believe that the ACTA Agreement is a red Herring being used as an excuse to monitor the internet for reasons other than copyright violations. Incumbent politicos could monitor the opposition parties communications in the name of looking for copyright violations. Remember the little old lady in tennis shoes that had an auto accident and could not be located. The government used that incident as a reason to required all new cellphones to report their positions. I have not heard about many persons saved by the technology locating them in an emergency, but most prosecutors will use cell phone position records to convict even it the charge is spitting on the side walk.
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travelguy @ 4th Nov 10:33AM:
Re: New business models?
No - his point was that there are examples where people will pay a lot for something (bottled water), even though it is generally available for free (tap water, water fountains, etc).
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jester121 @ 4th Nov 10:34AM:
Re: New business models?
said by travelguy :
No - his point was that there are examples where people will pay a lot for something (bottled water), even though it is generally available for free (tap water, water fountains, etc).
I got his point -- but that water isn't really FREE. Someone is paying for it, just not the consumer. The fact that it's given away doesn't change the cost.
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barn25 @ 4th Nov 10:52AM:
Just go o wikileaks..
I been reading ifomation about the acta from wikileaks they got a lot of scanned drafts of it. thats where the "bits and pieces" keep coming from
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Rob @ 4th Nov 10:53AM:
Re: Amerika
*yawn*
The FCC? A joke.
NASA? Losing their funding.
US Postal Service? Going out of business.
OSHA? A respected department.
Police and fire departments? Budget issues. Funding problems. Lack of resources.
The Internet? Thanks to private companies for building it out and making it what it is.
--
CheckSite.us | YourIP.us | Reverseip.us
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Desdinova @ 4th Nov 11:32AM:
Re: New business models?
"The fact that it's given away doesn't change the cost."
Nor does it change its value as evidenced by the fact that many folks with access to the freely available water will still pay for it. Just as happens with all the freely available music, movies and TV shows: despite the reality that anyone with an internet connection can easily get all of this stuff free, the overwhelming majority still choose to pay for this content.
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Van @ 4th Nov 11:35AM:
Re: Danger Will Robinson
I am surprised that those groups still are trying to fight a battle that IMO they just won't win.
I am not saying give up but they aren't going to just stop piracy all together
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Pv8man @ 4th Nov 11:37AM:
Re: Just go o wikileaks..
I just send this article to InfoWars.com
They usually have all the dirt on what secret gov is doing.
That makes me ask a question. What do you people think about the NSA's new ultra secret 1.5 million square foot data center that can store yottabytes.
Do you think they are archiving all social networking info that's on the entire Internet?
Thoughts or comments or speculation would be appreciated.
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jester121 @ 4th Nov 11:41AM:
Re: New business models?
Of course -- I could get away with shutting off the water to my house! Bring home gallon jugs from work for drinking, and hell, I have a health club membership that includes a locker room with showers. I can't figure out a way to get my clothes cleaned for free yet though. :D
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travelguy @ 4th Nov 11:41AM:
Re: New business models?
Yep. The bottom line is that context is what adds value, not the item itself. I buy bottles of soda at work and pay double the price I would from a grocery store. Why? I'm buying "cold" and "convenience".
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thevorpal @ 4th Nov 11:57AM:
Re: Classification
Hey, another Slashdotter. ;)
But either way, unless you are the same Slashdotter that posted the nearly identical post, I think we are going to have to count this as 'Strike 1' for you.
:)
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Jason Levine @ 4th Nov 11:58AM:
Termination upon Allegation?
Gotta love this part: "ISPs would be required to automatically terminate a customer upon a rightsholders' repeat allegation of copyright infringement at a particular IP address."
So all the RIAA/MPAA has to do is allege that I've been pirating music/movies a couple of times and I'll be kicked off? No burden of proof or court cases to determine my guilt, mind you. The mere fact that a giant, copyright owning corporation says I'm guilty is enough to shut off my Internet connection. Does that work both ways? Can I allege that they've infringed my copyright (I do create some copyrightable works) a few times (whether or not they have) and get them kicked offline? Why do I think there are processes in place that would penalize me for trying to do this but are effectively useless if they falsely get me kicked offline?
--
-Jason Levine
Support a children's charity. Buy a calendar and/or a photo book. Shooting For A Cause
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Desdinova @ 4th Nov 12:03PM:
Re: New business models?
"I can't figure out a way to get my clothes cleaned for free yet though."
Easy, don't take your clothes off when you shower at the gym! Of course, if you're paying for that gym membership than some of the membership fee probably subsidizes the water being used... :p
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NOVA_Guy @ 4th Nov 12:21PM:
Re: Classification
No matter what the source, secret laws that are hashed out without the full open participation of our elected representatives are bad ideas.
This appears to be yet another step to bring the US under control of some non-elected, non-responsive, non American international board of thugs. As such it should be resisted with every fiber of our being. We are Americans; our nation and her citizens should be subject only to US laws, and not be answerable to some international body who is not charged with working in our best interest.
--
To all liberals: I am NOT one of your parents, so get the heck out of my wallet. It's time for you to grow up and take some personal responsibility for taking care of yourselves, which means not relying on the government to give it all to you.
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neowulf @ 4th Nov 12:21PM:
Re: Amerika
*Yawn*
.
The FCC? A joke. Plenty of privatized companies that are jokes yet request government funds. Connected Nation springs right to mind as soon as I think of one. Could probably list thousands.
NASA? Losing their funding. Which has been the general theme since the space race ended. With the current state of health care maybe funding would best be spent in other areas closer to home for the time being?
US Postal Service? Going out of business. Is in need of reform, it has been running too long without changes to business practices, the same as many privatized businesses that failed and requests bailouts.
The Internet? Thanks to private companies for building it out and... Which also request government subsidize while also requesting huge incentives such as tax cuts and breaks, that the common working man pays for.
Police and fire departments? Budget issues. Funding problems. Lack of resources. Even privatized security companies have this problem. As for fire departments, many run a voluntary program. People who do not even get paid, but do it for the good of a community. One of the few programs I will defend no matter the cost, if you never lost a home to a fire, well then you can't possibly understand. I think you made the mistake of pointing out one of the most glaring examples of the good socialize can be. If the world worked more like a voluntary fire department, the world would be a much nicer place. Here is someone making no money, out of the goodness of their hearts running into a home or business on fire they have no connection to risking their lives to save, Yeah I would love to see you tell one of those men and women to their face how privatized business could run their department better. And when I think of privatized business running a fire department, I always think of Marcus Licinius Crassus. A firefighter on the list of the all time richest people in the world, hmmm wonder how that happens...
Major investment firms in the US? In need of government bailouts.
The entire privatized banking/lending system of the US? In need of government bailouts.
The entire auto industry in the US? In need of government bailouts.
The entire housing market in the US? Total collapse, in need of more government bailouts.
Privatize health insurance in the US? While the bottom line looks great for them, it is a industry that will collapse under it's own weight just as the lending/banking companies. In this area alone, three hospitals have closed their doors. For some reason I do not think it is a sign that less people are getting sick, or in need of health care.
Interesting how with one hand the very privatize businesses that fund groups that talk about how socialization is bad for America, while the other hand grabs at US tax payer money.
It is hard to say many big corporations in America at this point are not in some way associated with socialization, when their goal is to become too big to fail to insure the government will back their business, then it is hard to argue the point of privatized is more secure and without fail of it's own.
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anon @ 4th Nov 12:27PM:
These people don't think things through
So when do we start the blockade of China since they produce bootlegs? That is the logical endpoint of this. :uhh:
Nemo
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jester121 @ 4th Nov 12:28PM:
Re: New business models?
I'd equate that to paying for internet access anyhow, right?
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DataDoc @ 4th Nov 12:30PM:
Re: Termination upon Allegation?
I believe the RIAA claims to represent ALL artists, even independents. So, claim away.
--
Global Warming alarmism makes Scientology look respectable.
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chronoss2009 @ 4th Nov 12:31PM:
As i said yesterday
this as is , is ILLEGAL IN CANADA
there going to have to sneak laws by us to make this work SO WATCH all laws that are crime based in the next little while and play that game
lets imagine how it can apply to this UNDEMOCRATIC facist
TREASONOUS GARBAGE
THAT'S RIGHT ACTA IS TREASON
it is a small group undermining YOUR DEMOCRACY
on November 11th remember that we fought 2 world wars and one in north Korea thats not even technically over.
MY GRANDFATHER FOUGHT
( its also his birthday if he were still alive ) there FOR OUR RIGHTS AND FREEDOMS.
And yes i have an honorable discharge form the Canadian armed forces.....and i think we should get the hell out of Afghanistan and let the Americans finish the insanity they started.
Many died ...Millions died. For what now i ask so a few traitorous greedy bastards could steal those rights away so they can have more yachts?
THIS IS getting sickening...
They are going ot hav eto amend the charter of rights and freedoms on 2 fronts which will be nearly impossible to do.
the right to be presumed innocent under one charter
and section 12 CRUEL and UNUSUAL PUNISHMENT
for it is both CRUEL and UNUSAL to pass judgement on a presumption of guilt until you are tried and convicted and if said treatment in due course causes harm or malice to said individual ( think about a disabled person with no other means of communications getting cut off wrongly )
DO YOU TAX payers want to fork out the cash for that?
So home networks hows that work does it hten by law force me to also become a cop cause FUCK THAT
im sick a govt interfering in my life
SIGN SIGN EVERYWHERE A SIGN
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PapaMidnight @ 4th Nov 12:41PM:
Re: Amerika
said by funchords :
ACTA, its agenda, and its secrecy all pre-dates Obama by a very long time.
Don't tell them that! It's all Obama's fault!
End sarcasm.
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PapaMidnight @ 4th Nov 12:41PM:
WTF?
• That ISPs have to proactively police copyright on user-contributed material. This means that it will be impossible to run a service like Flickr or YouTube or Blogger, since hiring enough lawyers to ensure that the mountain of material uploaded every second isn't infringing will exceed any hope of profitability.
• That the whole world must adopt US-style "notice-and-takedown" rules that require ISPs to remove any material that is accused -- again, without evidence or trial -- of infringing copyright. This has proved a disaster in the US and other countries, where it provides an easy means of censoring material, just by accusing it of infringing copyright.
• Mandatory prohibitions on breaking DRM, even if doing so for a lawful purpose (e.g., to make a work available to disabled people; for archival preservation; because you own the copyrighted work that is locked up with DRM)
You've gotta be sh**in me...
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MaynardKrebs @ 4th Nov 01:01PM:
Re: New business models?
said by jester121 :
I can't figure out a way to get my clothes cleaned for free yet though. :D
Drop them off at your mother's house?
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RocketChild @ 4th Nov 01:03PM:
Re: Classification
Ha! You caught that too! Bet there are more cross-site lurkers then we know.
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eugenegill @ 4th Nov 01:03PM:
Re: Termination upon Allegation?
said by Jason Levine :
So all the RIAA/MPAA has to do is allege that I've been pirating music/movies a couple of times and I'll be kicked off?
No, it's worse than that. All they have to do is allege that pirating is occurring at an IP address associated with your account. In other words, you have to play cop over anyone with potential access to your home network (kids, wife, granddad, dog, wireless moochers), and the ISP in turn plays cop over you.
This is know by its acronym for System for Total Awareness of Stolen Information.
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MaynardKrebs @ 4th Nov 01:07PM:
Re: WTF?
said by PapaMidnight :
• That ISPs have to proactively police copyright on user-contributed material. This means that it will be impossible to run a service like Flickr or YouTube or Blogger, since hiring enough lawyers to ensure that the mountain of material uploaded every second isn't infringing will exceed any hope of profitability.
• That the whole world must adopt US-style "notice-and-takedown" rules that require ISPs to remove any material that is accused -- again, without evidence or trial -- of infringing copyright. This has proved a disaster in the US and other countries, where it provides an easy means of censoring material, just by accusing it of infringing copyright.
• Mandatory prohibitions on breaking DRM, even if doing so for a lawful purpose (e.g., to make a work available to disabled people; for archival preservation; because you own the copyrighted work that is locked up with DRM)
You've gotta be sh**in me...
Nope. Read what has been leaked thus far about ACTA (www.michaelgeist.ca is a very good place to start) and you'll see that it's all pretty much as you have feared, and worse.
Cross a border with an iPod that has songs on it that aren't DRM'd and you could be looking at hard time in a Turkish prison, courtesy of Disney, Sony, Warner, et. al., and your friendly local Senator/Congressman's vote.
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TamaraB @ 4th Nov 01:09PM:
Abuse of copyright is a culture killer
Possibly the best overall expose' on this subject in general that I have seen is RiP! A Remix Manifesto. It explores the very nature, history, and future of IP and it's effect on our society and economy.
Bob
--
Would you ever go over to Czechoslovakia, and marry me daughter for me?"
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Harddrive @ 4th Nov 01:56PM:
Re: Classification
excuse me Mr. NOVA_Guy, but this is a 'whole world' initiative by the Office of the United States Trade Representative via the Anti-Counterfeiting Trade Agreement .
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nitzan @ 4th Nov 02:07PM:
Re: Classification
said by Time :The one the EFF sued to try and get information about but the Obama Administration classified as a state secret?
How's that CHANGE and transparency working out for you?
No kidding. With that useless $^$#@ in office - this kind of crap just might actually fly.
Governments need to think REAL HARD who votes for them and who can vote them out of office. Hint: it's not the corporations.
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Simba7 @ 4th Nov 02:10PM:
Re: Classification
said by nitzan :
Governments need to think REAL HARD who votes for them and who can vote them out of office. Hint: it's not the corporations.
Give 'em time.
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Harddrive @ 4th Nov 02:12PM:
Re: Classification
here's the actual agenda for today and tomorrow.
[att=1]
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Harddrive @ 4th Nov 02:15PM:
Re: Stupid regulations
Countries sign off on it. its a global initiative from the USA that is getting pushed by the MPAA/RIAA. kind of like a trade agreement.
--
I've come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass and i'm all outta bubblegum.
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Harddrive @ 4th Nov 02:29PM:
Re: Danger Will Robinson
they will win to a degree. the stupid sheeple will obey and not question it. the smart people will circumvent, invent, and continue to get what they want, when they want it.
but if they think that some 16 yr old with a netbook on an open Wi-Fi access point gives a shit about some 'Treaty', the MPAA/RIAA/US Government has a lot to learn.
--
I've come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass and i'm all outta bubblegum.
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Harddrive @ 4th Nov 02:41PM:
Re: Danger Will Robinson
remember all the fuss 'they' threw about VHS/Beta recorders? same type of product but in a digital world that just happens to be more easily obtainable.
if the entertainment industry could go back to pre-8 track recordablity & pre-VHS or Beta recordablity, they would. they don't know how to think when i comes to advancing their product via any new technology medium.
as far as mailing media discs with gigs of music on them through the mail. too late for them on that. people have been doing it already to keep prying internet eyes off of people's collections of entertainment media.
--
I've come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass and i'm all outta bubblegum.
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Harddrive @ 4th Nov 02:50PM:
Re: Just go o wikileaks..
it will be voice conversations (VoIP)/email/chat sessions/social networking sites/etc. anything that is transmitted across the internet can and will be copied then filtered for analysis.
--
I've come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass and i'm all outta bubblegum.
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KrK @ 4th Nov 02:54PM:
You'd better not piss off some Fanboi
.... he could have you banned off the Internet for life by simply issuing false infringement notices against you.
You get blackballed without any chance to defend yourself or appeal process (Your ISP will be required to kick you off by International law even if no proof is provided, all they have to do is get the notices of infringement activity on your IP.)
Banned for life. Apparently, world-wide, too.
Things just keep getting more and more fubar every year. Eventually the dissaffected and disavowed will have to push back with the only tools that will be available to them: Violence.
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
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Anonymous_ @ 4th Nov 02:55PM:
Re: Classification
said by Simba7 :
You honestly think if everyone knew of this that they'd approve?
I'm sure we'd have a cyber-equivalent of a Civil War.
to bad ISP are in the middle
because people will drop there internet to a lower cheaper speed if they can not download anything
i also see Direct download becoming more popular
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KrK @ 4th Nov 02:59PM:
Re: Classification
said by nitzan :
Governments need to think REAL HARD who votes for them and who can vote them out of office. Hint: it's not the corporations.
No. It's the Corporations that pay the money to spin the sheeple into voting the way they want. The Government has paid attention to where it's masters are, and it's not the people. Who do you think is writing this law anyway?
The guys who are all for this type of stuff are getting ready to regain power anyway.
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
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KrK @ 4th Nov 03:00PM:
Re: New business models?
iTunes has been working well.
Netflix is rollicking along.
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nitzan @ 4th Nov 03:05PM:
Re: Classification
Governments still need to keep up a facade of being "for the people". They can't completely screw us without even pretending to care about us. This WILL come back and bite whoever votes for this - if it even gets to a vote. (it shouldn't)
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Harddrive @ 4th Nov 03:16PM:
Re: As i said yesterday
through your angry halfway legible typing skills, i understand what you are saying.
what the MPAA/RIAA in the USA and the other Entertainment Organizations around the world Office of the United States Trade Representative is saying is that they want the Governments of all Countries that sign off on ACTA to ensure that ISPs are held accountable for their subscriber's actions, up to and including termination of service for the subscriber, blacklisted from any subscriber based ISP, criminal punishment for the subscriber, and subscriber fines. Also included are fines for ISPs that don't adhere to ACTA in those Countries that sign off on it, whether it be not buying certified filtering hardware/software, lack of monitoring, careless/reckless disregard for global policy, ignoring termination of service letters from the Global Intellectual Property Organization, not keeping/falsifying/destroying logs, etc, etc, etc.
--
I've come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass and i'm all outta bubblegum.
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Harddrive @ 4th Nov 03:36PM:
Re: Classification
yeah, right. like the average person remembers anything these days. only the ones of us that are technically savy will remember a vote like this. the knowledgeable digital rights citizen is a minority. the average voting numb-nutz won't care cause they'll dismiss it cause its a non-issue to them because they don't understand digital rights (like we ever had any).
and in 2050 when i'm 92 and some young 20-something whipper snapper posts something about digital rights on this board, i'll snap back at him saying that his great-great-grandparents gave it all away during the Bush/Obama Administrations because their old, assisted living asses were more concerned about Social Security, Medicare, and prescription drug options rather than the 12:00 that had been flashing on their ancient VCRs for 20 years.
--
I've come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass and i'm all outta bubblegum.
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Harddrive @ 4th Nov 03:47PM:
Re: New business models?
but the Entertainment Industry isnt happy about iTunes and Netflix.
iTunes from the RIAA: can't control the product like physical media.
Netflix from the MPAA: can't control the streaming movies like physical media.
the Entertainment Industry doesn't want to acknowledge or adopt what the consumer wants. and that is instant gratification.
i, the consumer, want my music now.
i, the consumer, want my movies now.
give me my music download with fair use rights.
give me my streaming movie in the comfort of my living room at the same time the movie premiers on the big screen.
--
I've come here to chew bubblegum and kick ass and i'm all outta bubblegum.
reply
Pv8man @ 4th Nov 03:51PM:
Re: You'd better not piss off some Fanboi
let us hope that you are wrong.
Although I don't think you are wrong i'm afraid.
Seriously though, with the new massive NSA data center in Utah.
The pres has officially been given the power to override government AND PRIVATE networks in the pretense of a so called "Cyber security emergency".....
which is something that happens everyday for years thanks to the Russians and Chinese.
So that's all it would take??? is a large DDOS attack for them to accept as an excuse to declare this so called "Cyber security emergency"
heh, will hackers no longer be called hackers?
Will they be called "Cyber terrorists?"
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Pv8man @ 4th Nov 03:54PM:
Re: You'd better not piss off some Fanboi
So my question to everyone here who can answer it is...
In that event...
Is it even possible to shut down ALL networks and communications nationwide??
How could we fight against it ???
COULD we fight against it ???
What kind of alternatives would we all use if something like that ever happened to arise???
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KrK @ 4th Nov 04:18PM:
Re: New business models?
Absolutely I agree.
However, it does prove there are business models in full competition with piracy and they are succeeding.
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Kylemaul @ 4th Nov 04:28PM:
Re: You'd better not piss off some Fanboi
It's just two post above yours.
said by KrK :
Eventually the dissaffected and disavowed will have to push back with the only tools that will be available to them: Violence.
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Pv8man @ 4th Nov 05:05PM:
Re: You'd better not piss off some Fanboi
yeah, I read that, but...
Violence is not the only tool, possibly last resort if anything.
But I'm asking about all the non-violent ways we can fight back?
Can't we fight back with ACTUAL tools and technology as a means of establishing our own communications?
I think we can ALL learn from the Iranian revolution 2.0 how they did things when all communications were cut.
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gorehound @ 4th Nov 05:28PM:
Boycott Hollywood,MPAA, and RIAA
I have been on a personal boycott of all things Hollywood and bigwig greedbags RIAA and their stogge labels/artists.
This is what I have been doing:
1.I no longer buy any music except for local artists and indie small label artists
2.I no longer buy nay movies from Hollywood but will buy indie small filmmakers
3.If I need to buy a movie I find it used and start my search at a local store that sells used stuff.If not local I will buy a used copy from ebay or amazon
4.If I follow a TV show I will support that show by buying a new DVD Boxset and hope it will help to renew the show I follow.
How many folks will follow me ? How many will ask their friends and spread the word ?
And if this ACTA krap happens how many will truly boycott this disgusting greedy BS industry ????
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Transmaster @ 4th Nov 05:43PM:
Re: Danger Will Robinson
How well I remember the fuss over the VCR. the pissing and moaning was incredible. Then they found out these same players could play tapes of all of the old movies they had been sitting on, very poorly as it turned out, and the discovered a new market for these old works, at least the ones that where left. It sparked a whole industry of restoration and marketing of these old movies.
The music industry is even worse. they are sitting on 60 plus years of recordings. most of which are not available in any format for sale. Yet they piss and moan when somebody has to bootleg a copy so they can at least hear something. I enjoy Kay Kyser the big band director he recorded numerous records, and Radio shows. The masters are out there but try to find and of his stuff presently. The only way to get them is if somebody shares them online.
--
I am quite sure now that often, very often, in matters concerning religion and politics a man's reasoning powers are not above the monkey's.
- Mark Twain in Eruption
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Kylemaul @ 4th Nov 06:36PM:
Re: You'd better not piss off some Fanboi
I could see wifi becoming its own independent internet of sorts.
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ricep5 @ 4th Nov 07:18PM:
Re: Danger Will Robinson
If this treaty is enforced as well as all of the other treaties we have agreed to over the years, I would say it doesn't have a chance.
Ask the American Indians!
Ask the Americans in 1812 when the British broke the Treaty of Paris.
Need something more recent?
Ask our preferred trade partners in China, (via the WTO Treaty) home to the .99 first run DVD. (GI Joe anyone?)
Hah! Ask Microsoft about .99 Windows 7 DVD's in Hong Kong!
If this flies, the market for private VPN clouds will burst (no pun).
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cornelius785 @ 4th Nov 07:54PM:
encryption anyone?
So how much longer till everything being sent across the internet is in some encrypted form (and possibly goes through a network like TOR)? if crap like this continues to be pushed behind the people's backs, I can easily see many people getting ticked and start using encryption and anonymization techniques as part of a larger protest against this crap.
as others have said, 'so much for transparency...' . i just fail to see how ACTA is classfied as a state secret. maybe 'the man' is afraid that if this gets leaked out (which it will i'm almost sure) it'll cause an up roar or revolt.
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Pv8man @ 4th Nov 08:08PM:
Re: You'd better not piss off some Fanboi
Either that, or...
maybe someone somewhere will build their own wireless network devices with ranges FAR FAR FARRRRR past the limits set by the FCC.
Pirate radios and Wi-Fi routers will beefed up with amplifiers that are very strong.
FUCK all the signal strength limits that the FCC says we have to follow....at this point in time (if this happens) I hope people everywhere do the same and also start pirate radio stations EVERYWHERE !!!!!....and i mean EVERYWHERE
They can't stop us all !!!
Learn from the Iranian revolution 2.0 , when all of their communications were cut.
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chronoss2009 @ 4th Nov 08:32PM:
Re: As i said yesterday
said by Harddrive :
through your angry halfway legible typing skills, i understand what you are saying.
what the MPAA/RIAA in the USA and the other Entertainment Organizations around the world Office of the United States Trade Representative is saying is that they want the Governments of all Countries that sign off on ACTA to ensure that ISPs are held accountable for their subscriber's actions, up to and including termination of service for the subscriber, blacklisted from any subscriber based ISP, criminal punishment for the subscriber, and subscriber fines. Also included are fines for ISPs that don't adhere to ACTA in those Countries that sign off on it, whether it be not buying certified filtering hardware/software, lack of monitoring, careless/reckless disregard for global policy, ignoring termination of service letters from the Global Intellectual Property Organization, not keeping/falsifying/destroying logs, etc, etc, etc.
which in Canada is at lest 3 charter of rights and freedoms violations sorry i was tired and just woke up.
i should go back tidy it up and re-edit parts yea. BUT most get the meaning.....i really am NOT going to wear a poppy any more cause what my grandfather fought for in world war 1 and 2 is dead its been stripped away by reagonite like greed.
Democracy or not that is the question.
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chronoss2009 @ 4th Nov 08:33PM:
how hackers end the internet
we hack you do pirating you get caught and one strike
we rove about and sooner or later there is no one left on the net.
ENJOY cause that is what will happen
there is no security thats 100% tight to prevent it there is no way to stop it and your all going to have to enjoy the love.
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Rogue Wolf @ 4th Nov 08:37PM:
Re: Amerika
Nah, maybe just time to completely remove money from politics. Debates and commercials funded by taxpayer money, equal amounts for each candidate. Politicians completely forbidden from accepting gifts or donations from anyone. All that counts is one person, one vote.
I think that would go a long way towards restoring power to the people.
--
Hexadecimal humor really turns me 0FF.
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Desdinova @ 4th Nov 08:56PM:
Re: You'd better not piss off some Fanboi
Since most Americans can't even be bothered to use their vote, I doubt that they'll use a gun (or any other means of violence).
I don't doubt that there are a number of folks who WILL happily instigate violence over such draconian ISP measures; look at what a lot of the PETA and ALF wonks do in the name of field mice and lab rats, but I'm not sure that such actions will help the cause so long as most Americans happily trust the data fed to them by controlled sources. IF a group or groups were to try and rise up, I suspect that they would quickly be labeled terrorists and the media reporting would reflect the agenda of the Powers That Be, rather than a more unbiased evaluation of the group.
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knightmb @ 4th Nov 09:00PM:
Re: Classification
said by thevorpal :
Hey, another Slashdotter. ;)
But either way, unless you are the same Slashdotter that posted the nearly identical post, I think we are going to have to count this as 'Strike 1' for you.
:)
A good joke I heard on slashdot one time.
"I have 100s of slashdot accounts all with perfect karma and moderator points" :D
--
Fight Insight Ready (Was NebuAD) and the like:
Click Here to pollute their data
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KrK @ 4th Nov 09:50PM:
Re: You'd better not piss off some Fanboi
Americans don't care until you try and take things away from them they like. If people start getting banned off the Internet and losing access to their TV and entertainment, they will go ape****.
Violence is the last choice, but when your own Government is writing the laws you can't fight on behalf of corporate interests, and when such interests are protected World wide (so you can't escape them anywhere) you're out of legal options. All that's left is the illegal.
I personally feel that "Hacker" is going to become to mean two things: "Terrorist" to Corporations and Governments, and "Freedom Fighter" to the rest of us!
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
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KrK @ 4th Nov 09:54PM:
Re: Amerika
Uh, hardly. It's the exact opposite of socialism. Well, I take that back. It's the application of Government intervention in the markets, which could be considered socialism, except it's going the wrong way: It's all for the Corporations and AGAINST the common folk, so it's against the ideals of socialism... but then again, that's what we've had for years. Actually, I think the best term to use would be fascism / corporatism, according to Mr. Mussolini himself! (See tagline!)
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
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KrK @ 4th Nov 09:56PM:
Re: These people don't think things through
These people think this treaty will STOP China from bootlegging, and they'll make windfall profits when all of sudden everyone starts consuming mass amounts of US produced movies, music, software, books, etc etc
They are such silly fools. It won't stop Chinese pirates, and it will oppress the citizens of all nations who stupidly sign on thinking it's a good thing.
--
"Fascism should more properly be called corporatism because it is the merger of state and corporate power." -- Benito Mussolini
reply
Pv8man @ 4th Nov 11:38PM:
Re: You'd better not piss off some Fanboi
Sir, you raise a very good point.
and I fully agree...they will defiantly call a "Hacker" a
"Cyber Terrorist"
but we are Modern Age Freedom Fighters.
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phxmark @ 5th Nov 12:34AM:
Everyone need to boycott...
The Entertainment Industry. I have not been to a movie or bought a CD in the past seven years.
The only movies I buy are the ones in the bargain bin at the store. Yeah, I know it still supports them but they don't make as much money from it than when the movie came out 5 years ago.
All my music was ripped from CDs that friends have. I see the protections that the recording industry put on CDs is working out so well. I have no problems ripping using my Mac. Windows doesn't do so well with some of the copy protections.
--
High speed is dangerous. Too many MP3s, not enough time.
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elios @ 7th Nov 08:13PM:
Re: Amerika
saddly never happen becouse the VERY PEOPLE you would oust would have to pass it
nothing will change short of revolution and it may very well come to that yet
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GlobalMind @ 8th Nov 06:54PM:
Oh FUN!
Ahh yes termination of service on allegation of piracy. How wonderfully appropriate that is.
Don't bother with the whole "due process" thing, "innocent until proven guilty" yea that doesn't much matter I suppose.
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