Cisco: Average Connection Consumes 11.4 GB Per Month - P2P comprises just 38% of all Internet data
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Cisco: Average Connection Consumes 11.4 GB Per Month
P2P comprises just 38% of all Internet data
12:47PM Wednesday Oct 21 2009 by Karl Bode
tags: business · bandwidth · world · networking
According to a new survey from Cisco studying global broadband use, the average broadband connection generates approximately 11.4 gigabytes of Internet traffic per month. The survey included anonymous, aggregated network usage data provided by a group of more than 20 global ISPs. The data, which included largely residential but some business customers, suggests that about 10% of global users comprise about 60% of all global traffic, and the top 1% consumed about 20%. Some additional key points: • Globally, the average broadband connection consumes about 4.3 gigabytes of visual networking applications (defined as video, social networking and collaboration) traffic per month. • Internet "prime time" usually runs from about 9 pm to 1 am globally, in contrast to TV prime time which spans the hours between 7 p.m. and 11 pm. 25% (or 93.3 megabytes per day per connection) of global Internet traffic is generated during this period. • The study offers additional data to indicate P2P use is not the monster many had surmised, comprising just 38% of all Internet traffic. With all manner of video services growing a much faster rate, P2P's share is down from 50% in a recent Cisco survey.
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TKJunkMail @ 21st Oct 12:22PM:
AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
The numbers have shown what many have said - that transfer caps at 250 GB/mo and above are very reasonable and not some anti-competitive throttle on the internet. The only ones complaining are those who SHOULD BE paying more per month if they use more than that. And if you are in the TOP 10% you should pay more.
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grydlok @ 21st Oct 12:22PM:
Hmm
So now that a number been thrown out there will carriers need to place caps?
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tiger72 @ 21st Oct 12:26PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by TKJunkMail :
And if you are in the TOP 10% you should pay more.
Why? What is the cost to ISPs? It's not like a road where increased traffic = increased wear and tear, decreasing longevity, and hurting investment. And this aint Pre-Docsis where a single user could destroy everyone else's bandwidth.
--
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n2jtx @ 21st Oct 12:26PM:
Re: Hmm
said by grydlok :
So now that a number been thrown out there will carriers need to place caps?
Of course, at 11GB! Then charge $29.95 for each GB or fraction thereof over.
My sister and her family which comprise six people struggle under 60GB/month. That basically limits the household to 2GB/day shared amongst two parents and two teenagers with the other two being three and six years old.
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anon @ 21st Oct 12:33PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
Well, with profit margins on Internet services at 80 percent and rising, I think the answer is more that those in the top percent maybe should pay more, but the rest of us should be paying less -- alot less.
Of course, in this market, prices only ever go up.
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gpmoo7 @ 21st Oct 12:28PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
The problem is that people only use 10GB because they have caps ... if everyone were unlimited, they would use more data ;)
People don't want to check their bandwith usage every day to see if they can do or not do what they want.
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Matt @ 21st Oct 12:31PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
I would venture a guess that these numbers are inflated a little bit too. After all, Cisco wants to sell gear to ISPs so they can deal with all that traffic.
--
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SLD @ 21st Oct 12:31PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
You really should change your screename to "Boss Hogg".
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TKJunkMail @ 21st Oct 12:35PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by ZappaF :
Well, with profit margins on Internet services at 80 percent and rising
Care to back up that estimate of profit margin? SEC filed financial statements come NOWHERE NEAR that number.
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Raphion @ 21st Oct 12:43PM:
Guess I'm below average
hmmm... I've used 86.3GB so far this year, for an average of 7.8GB per month. Only two users on my connection though.
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Matt @ 21st Oct 12:44PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by TKJunkMail :said by ZappaF :
Well, with profit margins on Internet services at 80 percent and rising
Care to back up that estimate of profit margin? SEC filed financial statements come NOWHERE NEAR that number.
Gross margins aren't even close to that number.
--
"What is conservatism? Is it not adherence to the old and tried, against the new and untried?" - Abraham Lincoln
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MyDogHsFleas @ 21st Oct 12:49PM:
This validates everything the ISPs have been saying.
That the average user is far, far below any of the proposed caps.
That a very small fraction of users create most of the traffic. 10% of users create 60% of the traffic. 1% creates 20%.
That P2P is a HUGE part of all traffic. 38% is not minimal, it's immense.
I would bet, btw, that if you cross-referenced high P2P usage against the 1% of users who create 20% of the traffic, you'd see a very large correlation.
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anon @ 21st Oct 12:59PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
It is estimated that Cablevision enjoys “80 percent margins for wired high-speed Internet services.” See Jeff Baumgartner, “Does Cable Really Need Wireless?” Cable Digital News, Dec. 5, 2008.
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Sammer @ 21st Oct 12:55PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by TKJunkMail :
And if you are in the TOP 10% you should pay more.
Any caps set to affect pricing will surely affect more than just the top 10%!
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anon @ 21st Oct 12:59PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
Link here:
»www.lightreading.com/document.as···site=cdn
"Moffett believes Cablevision can pay for the buildout through the subscribers gained or retained for its wired broadband service. At an ARPU (average revenue per user) of $35 per month and 80 percent margins for wired high-speed Internet services."
You don't see numbers like this, b/c most companies don't publish sub-segment data like this in their 10-Ks. They'll show "wireline", and "wireless", or if they have specific information for "data", it never discusses costs, only revenues.
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Kearnstd @ 21st Oct 01:01PM:
Re: Hmm
said by n2jtx :said by grydlok :
So now that a number been thrown out there will carriers need to place caps?
Of course, at 11GB! Then charge $29.95 for each GB or fraction thereof over.
My sister and her family which comprise six people struggle under 60GB/month. That basically limits the household to 2GB/day shared amongst two parents and two teenagers with the other two being three and six years old.
ouch i think i alone move close to 2gb a day sometimes, if running Hulu, World of Warcraft and Ventrilo.
and forget a patch day i can blow past 2gb like nothing.
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aaronwt @ 21st Oct 01:02PM:
Re: Guess I'm below average
said by Raphion :
hmmm... I've used 86.3GB so far this year, for an average of 7.8GB per month. Only two users on my connection though.
I've used over 15TB so far this year. Although there is only one user on my connection, but I have over 60 devices that use internet access.
I'm paying less now for my internet access than before. When I was on the 50/20 tier i was paying $90 a month. Now that I'm on the 25/15 tier, I'm paying around $47 a month.
I do miss the extra speed on a daily basis. But I don't miss the extra cost.
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pokesph @ 21st Oct 01:04PM:
11GB is a bit low
I think those numbers are purposely deflated.
I'm a average user, youtube, websurfing, email and so on, yet have well over 11GB /mo traffic usage.
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Rob @ 21st Oct 01:07PM:
Too low.
I think 11GB a monthly is extremely low for an average home. I'm not where near a heavy users, but with 3 people using the Internet, we use on average 37GB a month (based on the data above in my image).
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R4M0N @ 21st Oct 01:08PM:
Big push for Caps
Of course... They see digital delivery in the horizon and want to set the low caps now before everyone and their mamas find out the convenience of downloading a movie on your Xbox360, PS3, Samsung HDTV, etc...
At about 3gb for an HD movie, I can go way past that 11gb average using my HDTV alone, no need for any other equipment. And before even turning my PC on for other internet-related tasks
Come on, people. Open your eyes.
Almost everything is getting "Internet-enabled" nowadays and some of those things will be bandwidth hogs. Letting caps be implemented now is just letting ISPs shackle you into high-prices later.
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tubbynet @ 21st Oct 01:08PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by TKJunkMail :
The numbers have shown what many have said - that transfer caps at 250 GB/mo and above are very reasonable and not some anti-competitive throttle on the internet. The only ones complaining are those who SHOULD BE paying more per month if they use more than that. And if you are in the TOP 10% you should pay more.
but, per the article (and the survey which the article is pulling information from), this is *global* usage, which could include areas that have little to no "local" web infrastructure (websites hosted within the country, providing faster responses); there is no point in surfing to youtube from lebanon if you can't get a decent video to play.
additionally, while the survey is quite light on details on which isps were in the survey and where they were located, this one fact makes me question the *true* accuracy of the article
Cisco collects anonymous, aggregate data about network usage from over 20 service providers worldwide participating in the Visual Networking Index Usage program. Participants in the program receive benchmarking reports comparing their traffic composition and growth to the average of the other participants.
without knowing the subscriber base size and location of each isp, i'd say there is room open for speculation. i'd be more interested in a breakdown of the usage *strictly* in the us by *all* hsi isps. this would be a little more relevant to how broadband policy in the us should be shaped. i mean, after all, weren't you just criticizing countries with "socialized" broadband and now you want to dictate your usage based on them? can't have it both ways ;-)
q.
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Eat Me @ 21st Oct 01:20PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by tiger72 :said by TKJunkMail :
And if you are in the TOP 10% you should pay more.
Why? What is the cost to ISPs? It's not like a road where increased traffic = increased wear and tear, decreasing longevity, and hurting investment. And this aint Pre-Docsis where a single user could destroy everyone else's bandwidth.
Actually the problem is oversubscription. If everyone were on full throttle 24x7 no one would be able to use their connection.
The reality is that most people don't need a full throttle connection 24x7 which is why we can have affordable broadband for home use.
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Vathral @ 21st Oct 01:26PM:
Re: Too low.
I just used up 12gb worth of bandwidth downloading 2 games through Steam. In this household, I'm the only one who has any clue about things like torrents and even then I don't download any music or movies since none of that interest me. I download about 7-10gb worth of anime and we will still manage to do ~120gb a month.
We don't transfer files between computers.
[att=1]
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grydlok @ 21st Oct 01:27PM:
Re: Hmm
I know that feeling.
I have 2 laptops, 1 desktop, 1 netbook, a 360 and PMD drinking band down like vitamin water in my house hold. I know I blow past 11 gig a month. I don't think I make 250 gig though.
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tubbynet @ 21st Oct 01:28PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by Eat Me :
If everyone were on full throttle 24x7 no one would be able to use their connection.
and a decent lot of isp gear would start dropping packets because even your switches/routers are oversubscribed.
q.
--
"...if I in my north room dance naked, grotesquely before my mirror waving my shirt round my head and singing softly to myself..."
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MovieLover76 @ 21st Oct 01:43PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
The critical error in your logic is that that ISP's are making very good profits with the current unlimited model they have, they may need to apply some QoS to busy nodes, but there is no network need for a limit on Bits per month.
Also it is anti-competitive, when looking to forecast future bandwidth usage, you don't look at what the average is today, you look at what the early adopters / High Bandwidth users are using. A HD netflix movie is easily 5GB alone, and they have a lot of room for improvement still (surround sound please)
I don't use P2P and I easily go through 250gb a month when you consider my bandwidth and my roommates as well. Caps are designed to prevent adoption of future higher bandwidth replacements for traditional cable services like netflix etc.
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jester121 @ 21st Oct 01:52PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
The data doesn't support that supposition at all.
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anon @ 21st Oct 02:24PM:
Re: Big push for Caps
R4MON,
You hit the nail square on the head!! People need to think ahead and realize most household devices will need to be connected to the internet in the near future. So will increase the amount of data flow to the average household. Just using Netflix watch instantly puts me over the 10 GB limit, not to mention all my other surfing and devices.
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anon @ 21st Oct 01:57PM:
11.4 GB That's just crazy
Everyone knows you can't use that much bandwidth, My ISP Frontier told me so...
" We all love the Internet, and Frontier is committed to offering you all the bandwidth you need and want to take full advantage of the Web! Our basic residential Internet packages offers 5GB usage -- that's the equivalent of 500,000 basic text e-mails, 2,500 Photos, 40,000 Web Pages, over 300 Hours of Online Game Time, 1,250 downloaded songs, or a mixture of the above!
How many gigabytes do I currently use per month?
Customer usage varies by household and by market. Our typical Frontier household uses less than 1.5GB or 1,500 megabytes a month. Many of our customers use a lot less than this amount and we only have a small number of customers who use more than this amount. "
»www.frontier.com/5GB/
In fact, since internet usage is so low, my ISP hasn't bothered to upgrade speeds for my area in over 5 years. Anyone coming over from Verizion is in for a real treat!
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gpmoo7 @ 21st Oct 02:04PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by jester121 :
The data doesn't support that supposition at all.
Which data? It's clear that the future is unlimited bandwidth for every one. That's it.
The future is FTTH starting à 100 Mb/s and going over Gb/s in a few years (that's a reality in some country, not in Canada).
All this bandwidth will be used by everyone ...
Of course, today, in Canada, people are stick to their 7Mb/s throttled Internet access with limited bandwidth so they just do IM, mails and Facebook ... who is going to rent an HD movie with this kind of Internet access ?
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AstroBoy @ 21st Oct 02:06PM:
Re: Guess I'm below average
said by aaronwt :
but I have over 60 devices that use internet access.
Wow, could you list some of these devices? I must be deprived, I only have about 15 or so. :)
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Nightfall @ 21st Oct 02:08PM:
Re: Too low.
said by Vathral :
I just used up 12gb worth of bandwidth downloading 2 games through Steam. In this household, I'm the only one who has any clue about things like torrents and even then I don't download any music or movies since none of that interest me. I download about 7-10gb worth of anime and we will still manage to do ~120gb a month.
We don't transfer files between computers.
[att=1]
The users on this site are very technically inclined. Comparing our usage and saying that the figures are too low is like a fat guy going to an all you can eat buffet and saying that the figures for how much their patrons eat (2 plates) is skewed too low just because he eats 7 plates of food. The average is 11.4G because there are a heck of a lot of lower tier users out there. Many people just surf and get mail. They don't do any kind of file sharing, steam, downloading, and so on.
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My domain - Nightfall.net
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jimbo2150 @ 21st Oct 02:08PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by Eat Me :
Actually the problem is oversubscription. If everyone were on full throttle 24x7 no one would be able to use their connection.
One of the issues that causes issues when oversubscription is done is that there is no option to get that kind of connection. Networks overtaxed: Have the heaviest users moved over to a more dedicated, pricier service: ooops! This is not available to most people to begin with.
--
- "Techie" Jim
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MovieLover76 @ 21st Oct 02:09PM:
Re: Guess I'm below average
60 internet devices?? really?
I have a lot of stuff myself but I don't think I could make it to 60
PS3,Xbox 360, Wii, 3 Laptops, 2 Computers, Xbox, Iphone, ATA adapter, Home Server
This is for 3 people and I can only get to 12
I know it slightly off topic, but how do you get to 60, I'm just curious.
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iansltx @ 21st Oct 02:12PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
It's available for me. $3000 for a 100 Mbit connection. No thanks.
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DaSneaky1D @ 21st Oct 02:13PM:
Re: Too low.
I tend to agree. 5 years ago, that would be very heavy for a home user. But, nowadays, we have videos on every social network, games on social networks, VoIP, Hulu (and type sites), Youtube (type sites), regular PC gaming, and not to mention console gaming (including updates, demos, and media).
Plus, direct download of Netflix....
If you compare a "modern" household to someone that simply checks email, you'll find that 11GB balance. Move "email users" out of the mix and you'll see that average explode.
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iansltx @ 21st Oct 02:14PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
I'm pretty sure that the sample size was big enough that caps weren't an issue. Everyone except mobile broadband providers have caps much higher than 11.4GB.
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Vathral @ 21st Oct 02:14PM:
Re: Too low.
said by Nightfall :said by Vathral :
I just used up 12gb worth of bandwidth downloading 2 games through Steam. In this household, I'm the only one who has any clue about things like torrents and even then I don't download any music or movies since none of that interest me. I download about 7-10gb worth of anime and we will still manage to do ~120gb a month.
We don't transfer files between computers.
[att=1]
The users on this site are very technically inclined. Comparing our usage and saying that the figures are too low is like a fat guy going to an all you can eat buffet and saying that the figures for how much their patrons eat (2 plates) is skewed too low just because he eats 7 plates of food. The average is 11.4G because there are a heck of a lot of lower tier users out there. Many people just surf and get mail. They don't do any kind of file sharing, steam, downloading, and so on.
Yeah, but at the same time the ISPs are trying to justify why they need such low caps and don't realize they do have customers who will be out of safe distance from their caps. It may or not even be a proper median since they don't really like to give out more info on it to the public. I understand what you're saying but you like others here must know there the demographic they are basing to place a cap is just screwy.
My upstairs neighbor does no P2P, no gaming whatsoever on her practically 7 year old Dell and she still pulls of 20gb+ off media filled websites like Youtube.
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iansltx @ 21st Oct 02:17PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
Agreed. I'm sure I'm in the top 10%, though I'm not in the top 1%. I'll pay $80 per month for an internet connection. But my parents, who are the average case, sure as heck better be paying $20 for the same-speed connection. Oh wait...they aren't.
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bender @ 21st Oct 02:17PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by TKJunkMail :
And if you are in the TOP 10% you should pay more.
funny, i say the same thing about taxes but those idiots don't seem to think so either.
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Pashune @ 21st Oct 02:21PM:
Re: Big push for Caps
It's anywhere from 60-100 gb per month for me.
TV sucks, I don't have any internet utilizing game consoles, and I try out some PC games, MMOs, etc., now and then.
I may download 11 gb in one day or download less than 1 gb in a day. It all depends on how busy I am... :D
5 people use my 5 mbit pipe; 2 of them being heavy users (My sister and I) and the other 3 being very light users.
Stay away from the blasted caps as I'm already dealing with threshold caps to begin with! Not to mention, $60 per month for just 5 mbits!
--
ISP: CableOne 5 mbit/500 kbit
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bender @ 21st Oct 02:22PM:
Re: Too low.
i believe this data is deflated, because if it does include EVERY internet subscription then you are including a LOT of accounts that see almost no usage. totally skewing the average. i'm taking a stats class right now, can you tell?
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mlong @ 21st Oct 02:23PM:
Usage
This is my pfSense firewall/router (first). I just set it up the other day when I changed ISPs. I have a 7 meg circuit through Qwest and it's been up for about a week now. So far I've downloaded 7.7 gigs. The second is for a 16 hour period.
I work from home full time and would consider myself a sort of power users but not necessarily a heavy user. I have a proxy server setup that my wife uses from work for browsing the web and IM. So during the day we're both using the internet and we tend to use it much less at night. I'm constantly using the internet. I use a Cisco softphone, VPN, and all sorts of other applications. I tend to download MSDN ISO images, I have one Mac, a Windows 7 Media center PC streaming Netflix and whatnot, and probably eight other computers in various states of usefulness around the house. Typically Windows machines that are updating at various times. I also stream Pandora all day long.
If you averaged my download out it'd be about 33 gigs a month roughly. While I hate the idea of caps and other restrictions on use, it turns out I don't even come close to the 250 gig limits you hear about for Comcast and other cable providers.
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Matt @ 21st Oct 02:28PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by gpmoo7 :said by jester121 :
The data doesn't support that supposition at all.
Which data? It's clear that the future is unlimited bandwidth for every one. That's it.
The future is FTTH starting à 100 Mb/s and going over Gb/s in a few years (that's a reality in some country, not in Canada).
All this bandwidth will be used by everyone ...
Of course, today, in Canada, people are stick to their 7Mb/s throttled Internet access with limited bandwidth so they just do IM, mails and Facebook ... who is going to rent an HD movie with this kind of Internet access ?
I've got access to a gigabit connection and a couple of 100Mbps ones. I can't find anything to tax the 100Mbps connection, much less the 1Gbps. There won't be a need for that type of bandwidth to the home for a lot longer than a couple of years, although I'd LOVE to be able to purchase one at a reasonable price right now.
--
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iansltx @ 21st Oct 02:34PM:
My Situation
I could never live on a 5GB per month MBB connection. While I was doing work on such a connection back home, I used ~1GB in a day. So 30GB in a month just for me.
Granted, looking at DD-WRT logs, the rest of the family (four people) used ~12GB in the month, without me home. However that was on a crapy 512k connection. I GUARANTEE they would've used more if the connection was 1.5/512 with high quality. YouTube won't even load on it.
Then again, every family member has their own computer, and my brothers like to play various games.
On my 22/5 connection I've used 73.2 GB so far this month. Yes I'm sure I'm in the top 10% but OTOH I'm not int he top 1%. Yes I download HD TV shows but I do my torrent seeding elsewhere and download only two TV shows per week, or about an hour of high quality video. The rest is YouTube or similar, with other folks using my connection on a periodic basis. Mostly just me though.
I transfer files over the connection for my job at school, upload large-ish PDFs, etc. over my cable internet. I'm using under 250GB per month and not hosting any public-facing servers on the connection, so I'm not going to sign a business-class contract that I'll have to break in a little over a year when I graduate.
Last month I used 164GB.
I have two laptops, a desktop, a Wii and an iPhone that tend to be on the network on a regular basis. One laptop tends to serve as an HTPC. The other is what I take to class, so maybe 20% of its internet traffic is on my campus network. If you add in file transfers on the campus LAN, the number is actually more like 80%.
I'm definitely not the normal case for internet usage; I think the rest of the guys in my apartment complex use ~50GB per month on a Qwest DSL connection, and there are about twenty of them. OTOH they also ahve the campus network, which is a lot faster than a 5/896 DSL connection...and none of them are gamers or the like.
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jay_rm @ 21st Oct 02:38PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by gpmoo7 :
The problem is that people only use 10GB because they have caps ... if everyone were unlimited, they would use more data ;)
People don't want to check their bandwith usage every day to see if they can do or not do what they want.
bah - I disagree.
My entire household uses an average of 8-12 Gb/mo. That's 2 young adults and their two tech savvy parents, one of which has a home office. We run our own mail server and a lightly used web server. We are NOT capped in any way.
The population as a whole uses WAY less then the average DSLR user. Frequent visitors to this site are probably all in the upper 10-15% of data volume.
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jay_rm @ 21st Oct 02:41PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by bender :said by TKJunkMail :
And if you are in the TOP 10% you should pay more.
funny, i say the same thing about taxes but those idiots don't seem to think so either.
Funny - those in the top 10% DO pay more (much more) taxes by virtue of having a high level of taxable income. Duh.
But, that's off topic...
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djeremy @ 21st Oct 02:50PM:
Cisco is just trying to sell equipment
My guess is that they have some new device they are trying to peddle to ISPs that does some sort of data tallying per connection and needed a study/survey to help sell it.
Remember, Cisco came out with AT&T and Verizon a while back as being against network neutrality because they sell traffic prioritization and shaping devices.
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gpmoo7 @ 21st Oct 02:54PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by iansltx :
I'm pretty sure that the sample size was big enough that caps weren't an issue. Everyone except mobile broadband providers have caps much higher than 11.4GB.
Yes but 11.4GB is a worldwide average including countries where Internet is almost not used ... so the average in ... let's say, the G8 countries (Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Japan, Russia, UK, US) should be more like 30GB or more ... (I hope ;))
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iansltx @ 21st Oct 02:58PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
I'm pretty sure that Cisco picked twenty relatively high-profile broadband providers. Also, 11.4 GB per connection seems to be about right...
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Matt @ 21st Oct 03:02PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by jay_rm :said by bender :said by TKJunkMail :
And if you are in the TOP 10% you should pay more.
funny, i say the same thing about taxes but those idiots don't seem to think so either.
Funny - those in the top 10% DO pay more (much more) taxes by virtue of having a high level of taxable income. Duh.
But, that's off topic...
It is, but you have to factor in purchasing power and cost of living. 20% of $1,000,000 isn't as big a deal as 20% of $30,000.
--
"What is conservatism? Is it not adherence to the old and tried, against the new and untried?" - Abraham Lincoln
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tubbynet @ 21st Oct 03:13PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by iansltx :
I'm pretty sure that Cisco picked twenty relatively high-profile broadband providers.
not quite an assumption i'm willing to make. i would assume that most of these isps would have to have a working relationship with cisco, in the form of account managers and sales engineers. through these relationships, cisco would pitch the box that collects the survey data onto the isp network.
a company that is running juniper switch/routers utilising alcatel dslams or motorola cmts units is not going to have the working relationship/trust with cisco to say "sure, through that big box collecting data into the network". in fact, just like there is an mac vs. windows debate, there is the same in the enterprise/service provider space with juniper and cisco (and some others like force10). some people patently refuse to run c* gear because they only like j* gear. from an issue of interoperability, it makes sense to stick with what you have, but i digress.
at any rate, if the isp does not have a working relationship with cisco, they aren't going to be part of this survey. i would say that this cuts out a good chunk of isps from the mix.
q.
--
"...if I in my north room dance naked, grotesquely before my mirror waving my shirt round my head and singing softly to myself..."
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gpmoo7 @ 21st Oct 03:30PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by Matt :
I've got access to a gigabit connection and a couple of 100Mbps ones. I can't find anything to tax the 100Mbps connection, much less the 1Gbps. There won't be a need for that type of bandwidth to the home for a lot longer than a couple of years, although I'd LOVE to be able to purchase one at a reasonable price right now.
That's the future of broadband Internet. Isn't great to know that the speed is not an issue because you can't find anything to use it all?
100 Mb/s today is like a virtually unlimited speed!
Tomorrow, HDTV will go IPTV with 20 Mb/s for an HD channel and multiple channels through the same Internet access ...
This tomorrow is going to happen sooner than you think ... at least in countries where unlimited bandwidth and 20 Mb/s is for everyone today (even if you doesn't think you need it ;)) and FTTH on his way.
As of today, I really think that unlimited 20Mb/s should be available for everyone ... at least in the biggest cities in North America.
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Selenia @ 21st Oct 03:42PM:
Seems fishy
Are the ISPs providing this data or is Cisco measuring traffic being routed from the ISPs for this claim? I am down to about 80 GB/month use. I am unthrottled/unlimited. I use Free Open Source software(Linux ftw) and do frequent audio/video streaming(most of it not HD). I also keep one small folder synced with my other house(uses less than 10 GB, at most, but usually in the MBs/month) I don't download alot of large files(maybe a few CD images and 1 DVD image per month, legally). My computers regularly check repositories and update daily, which uses minimal bandwidth 99% of the time). Most apps I download from the repos are XX MB max, most are X MB(and still many are in the KBs in size). Other than that, I browse the web , play my fav MMO(FFXI) on a console(it can use several GBs on its own in a month just updating X 2 consoles), and chat like most people. Most of my intensive work is done locally.
I do realize I utilize the internet more than most and maybe for a few more things, but I don't do anything unusually bandwidth intensive. I only use torrents and such maybe a couple-few times/month. Most of them are not huge files. I'd hate to see what daily downloaders consume. I used to use them a bit more, which is why my usage used to be much greater than 80 GB.
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openbox9 @ 21st Oct 03:52PM:
Re: Too low.
But it's the average ;)
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IPPlanMan @ 21st Oct 04:11PM:
Comcast Usage Data Supposedly Shows 2-4 GB Median Use...
»customer.comcast.com/%28X%281%29···1#normal
Comcast usage data supposedly shows 2-4 GB median use to justify 250 GB cap.
I call BS on this...
--
"We're going to start at one end of (Fallujah), and we're not going to stop until we get to the other. If there's anybody left when that happens, we're going to turn around and we're going to go back and finish it."
Lt. Col. Pete Newell: 1st Inf. US Army
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anon @ 21st Oct 04:11PM:
Not a lot of bandwidth
When you look at this in terms of bandwidth (data rate per second) instead of total transfer per month, you see a very low bandwidth average.
If you take a month as being 30 days, a normal billing cycle, then you get:
35kbits/sec as the average.
That jives with real data I have seen from a major ISP for 2008, which I have posted before, where their average per customer was 42k/sec.
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iansltx @ 21st Oct 04:11PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
Comcast uses Cisco. Pretty sure AT&T does. TWC probably does. Though Comcast doesn't use Cisco on the CMTS side (because their CMTSes don't know how to load balance worth a crap).
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bender @ 21st Oct 04:14PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
the arguement was that they should pay more(than they already do)
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bender @ 21st Oct 04:15PM:
Re: Too low.
i understand that it is the average, but if you have 5 million accounts with less than 100mb of data usage every month and 2 million with over 300gb every month it will not average out correctly. i want to see the median and mode of the data that they collected. then I will draw my own conclusion of the data.
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axiomatic @ 21st Oct 04:26PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
I'm in the top 10% with mostly business traffic, and I pay for a premium tier of service.
So since I pay more because I use more, shouldn't my cap be higher? Or no cap at all?
Also, I want to buy a plan without a cap. Hey Mr. ISP can I pay my way out of a cap?
Didn't think so. I'm the best customer Comcast has paying them $300 per month (without fail) and I'm treated like a fucking crook. How that for value?
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bender @ 21st Oct 04:26PM:
Re: Guess I'm below average
i reset my router just 5 days ago(it was acting flaky). since then I have downloaded over 11gb and uploaded over 7gb. that is just over 5 days. tomorrow I will be downloading windows 7 so you can safely add 8gb to that total.
this information is seriously deflated for anyone that seriously uses the internet. they need to come up with numbers for someone who actually utilizes their connection. not for grandpa and grandma who just check their email and play on yahoo games. they should drop about the bottom 15% of users from the data as it should be understood that those users probably only have internet for no general reason and will never hit any kind of cap. they don't drop that data however because it will skew the results.
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bender @ 21st Oct 04:28PM:
Re: This validates everything the ISPs have been saying.
i do not use P2P except to download linux iso's and that is very rare. I still go far over 11gb. I can transfer 11gb in less than a week my friend. 11gb is less than 3 single layer dvds. its not much. we need to get out of the cd mindset. they should be worried about TB of transfer, not GB.
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IPPlanMan @ 21st Oct 04:34PM:
Re: This validates everything the ISPs have been saying.
TB is a foreign concept to ISP's like Comcast.
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nevtxjustin @ 21st Oct 04:37PM:
11 GB max sounds right for average user
Reading over the responses, I see a lot of people saying how much more they use past 11 GB. The fact you are even posting that here in DSLReports would indicate you're more than just a cut above the average user, so of course your usage is going to be greater.
But what is an average user? Or even a light user? After I gave an example of a light user as someone in a Phoenix retirement community that uses the web to download pics of the grandkids and for Socialist Insecurity and Medicare forms, Rory pointed out it is those users that download tons of NetFlix and become heavy users.
Caps aren't about truly unlimited bandwidth, it isn't about the average user...its about limiting the small percent of users that can take down a system.
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jjeffeory @ 21st Oct 04:38PM:
Re: Too low.
It's probably includes dial up as well...
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weaseled386 @ 21st Oct 04:40PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by iansltx :
Comcast uses Cisco. Pretty sure AT&T does.
There is very little Cisco equipment in the AT&T Central Offices. What Cisco equipment is there is currently being phased out for Juniper (MX480's and MX960's). The VRAD backbone is Alcatel routers & switches.
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bender @ 21st Oct 04:43PM:
Re: Too low.
said by jjeffeory :
It's probably includes dial up as well...
DING DING DING DING DING!!!!
thats gotta be it. idiots included all the dialup lines out there as "broadband" connections. regardless this "study" is flawed as hell.
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Nightfall @ 21st Oct 04:49PM:
Re: Too low.
said by bender :said by jjeffeory :
It's probably includes dial up as well...
DING DING DING DING DING!!!!
thats gotta be it. idiots included all the dialup lines out there as "broadband" connections. regardless this "study" is flawed as hell.
quote:
According to a new survey from Cisco studying global broadband use...
Dialup is broadband? I doubt it. Maybe 384k lines, but those are few and far between.
11.4GB per month sounds like a pretty accurate average to me. There is a huge difference between the broadband pigs and people who don't use their lines very much.
--
My domain - Nightfall.net
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anon @ 21st Oct 04:58PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
again why go back to paying for usage? That is like going back to candles instead of the light bulb. We had pay for usage billing with dial up we have move on billing for usage is obsolete
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Matt @ 21st Oct 04:56PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by iansltx :
Comcast uses Cisco. Pretty sure AT&T does. TWC probably does. Though Comcast doesn't use Cisco on the CMTS side (because their CMTSes don't know how to load balance worth a crap).
Time Warner definitely does.
--
"What is conservatism? Is it not adherence to the old and tried, against the new and untried?" - Abraham Lincoln
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bender @ 21st Oct 04:59PM:
Re: Too low.
people don't understand what an average when it comes to statistics. with large amounts of data it means nothing. you have to look at the distribution to get an accurate picture of all of the data.
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scoopy03 @ 21st Oct 05:03PM:
Re: Hmm
said by grydlok :
I know that feeling.
I have 2 laptops, 1 desktop, 1 netbook, a 360 and PMD drinking band down like vitamin water in my house hold. I know I blow past 11 gig a month. I don't think I make 250 gig though.
I go past 11GB easily every week not even really doing much. A few weeks ago I did one 3.5 Hour HD stream and it was 11GB for that one day.
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Ebolla @ 21st Oct 05:11PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
They may not use as much bandwidth as you but they can if they choose to. Do you pay less for a car if you decide not to drive it more then 1-2 miles a week? no you don't.
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iansltx @ 21st Oct 05:18PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
No, but you pay less for gas. A better analogy, which would hold true, is you don't pay more for a modem or router just because you use the service more. Though a more expensive router tends to go faster.
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MyDogHsFleas @ 21st Oct 05:19PM:
Re: This validates everything the ISPs have been saying.
said by bender :
i do not use P2P except to download linux iso's and that is very rare. I still go far over 11gb. I can transfer 11gb in less than a week my friend. 11gb is less than 3 single layer dvds. its not much. we need to get out of the cd mindset. they should be worried about TB of transfer, not GB.
Yes the developer/designer user, like you (and me by the way), who legally downloads lots of software, certainly exists. I would still bet that there's a large correlation between P2P usage and being in that tiny minority of users who create the bulk of the traffic.
Out of curiosity -- how much would you say you download? Or do you actually know (have some meter installed)? Personally I'm probably around 20GB/month, but that's a guess, and some months are higher.
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lastmile @ 21st Oct 05:23PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
Although you wouldn't pay more for the same car, you would pay considerably more for wear && tear, usage, gas and insurance if you choose to use it (or the service) more often.
Network gear && pipes are subject to wear and tear, maintenance costs and insurance I would suspect.
I don't think its out of line to charge more for the high-end bandwidth users.
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pog @ 21st Oct 05:24PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by Matt :
It is, but you have to factor in purchasing power and cost of living. 20% of $1,000,000 isn't as big a deal as 20% of $30,000.
"big deal" to whom? I expect the bigger deal is that the guy making $30,000 only makes $30,000... isn't that what it all reduces to?
Why do I get the feeling that a larger and larger group of people won't be happy until the guy earning $30,000 gets a tax credit of say $10,000 and the guy making $1,000,000 pays 96% in taxes?
--
My Site
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Madtown @ 21st Oct 05:31PM:
Hmm wonder if that includes Netflix, Hulu
• Internet "prime time" usually runs from about 9 pm to 1 am globally, in contrast to TV prime time which spans the hours between 7 p.m. and 11 pm. 25% (or 93.3 megabytes per day per connection) of global Internet traffic is generated during this period.
TV Primetime is between 7pm and 11pm, I wonder if anyone watching The Office on Hulu or Dexter on Netflix during those times?
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Madtown @ 21st Oct 05:39PM:
Re: 11GB is a bit low
said by pokesph :
I think those numbers are purposely deflated.
I'm a average user, youtube, websurfing, email and so on, yet have well over 11GB /mo traffic usage.
[att=1]
Image only show 1 computer..
How much traffic do you use for Xbox Live and Netflix, it doesn't count that.
btw, how did you post that on here?, I would like to do the same thing.
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chimera @ 21st Oct 05:40PM:
Just Ran the Numbers
I got bored and ran the numbers on this. According to those statistics the top 1% of users consume an average of 228GB per month while the bottom 99% consume an average of 9.21GB per month. To me this isn't actually that bad a spread. It means that top 1% only use 25 times the bandwidth of the bottom 99% of users. Assuming that they charge everyone the cost of providing 1.5 normal users access per month that means that they still make a healthy profit and can continue to expand their network. Knowing these numbers makes me support metered billing less. :(
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Madtown @ 21st Oct 05:46PM:
Netflix Traffic
How much traffic does Netflix use on the Instant Watch? Let say I watch a movie that is 2 hrs long.
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WernerSchutz @ 21st Oct 06:02PM:
Re: This validates everything the ISPs have been saying.
said by IPPlanMan :
TB is a foreign concept to ISP's like Comcast.
Except that they think tuberculosys when they see such heavy usage :)
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gorehound @ 21st Oct 06:03PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
I host a large website and I am an artist with a lot of things for people to download.
The biggest download would be downloading my Holocaust DVD.
A Family Journey Backwards is a 5 1/2 hour detailed study of Jewish life in the Carpathian mountain/Northern Transylvanian region before,during,and immedaitely after World War 2.
This documentary is available on my site for free and can be downloaded at master quality 6 DVD Set.That menas your stupid 11 gig is krap because it would be equal to 2 months worth...it is a 23 roughly gig download.
I never want to see any capping of anyones accounts.i want to pay a flat rate.i do not want to see folks not want to download my art because of some stupid greedy cappping behavior.
if you are interested go here for my holocaust site before you are capped i guess.
»www.bigmeathammer.com/aushwitz.htm
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bender @ 21st Oct 06:08PM:
Re: This validates everything the ISPs have been saying.
dd-wrt is on my edge router. those stats are for my wan connection. wish dd-wrt had easier to setup ipv6 support.
i've only had the router for a week and already am loving the bandwidth tracking capabilities of it. wish that it could track on an ip by ip basis. instead it just shows a general overview of all the connections. if i ever get an extra computer around here i will use pfsense to track my usage.
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openbox9 @ 21st Oct 06:32PM:
Re: Too low.
Don't worry. Unless the world's users of the Internet are freaks of nature, I'm sure you'd see a nice bell curve.
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bender @ 21st Oct 07:23PM:
Re: Too low.
your probably right, but i'd still like to see it. otherwise it tells me nothing of the distribution of the data.
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jester121 @ 21st Oct 07:49PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by tubbynet :said by iansltx :
I'm pretty sure that Cisco picked twenty relatively high-profile broadband providers.
not quite an assumption i'm willing to make. i would assume that most of these isps would have to have a working relationship with cisco, in the form of account managers and sales engineers. through these relationships, cisco would pitch the box that collects the survey data onto the isp network.
a company that is running juniper switch/routers utilising alcatel dslams or motorola cmts units is not going to have the working relationship/trust with cisco to say "sure, through that big box collecting data into the network". in fact, just like there is an mac vs. windows debate, there is the same in the enterprise/service provider space with juniper and cisco (and some others like force10). some people patently refuse to run c* gear because they only like j* gear. from an issue of interoperability, it makes sense to stick with what you have, but i digress.
at any rate, if the isp does not have a working relationship with cisco, they aren't going to be part of this survey. i would say that this cuts out a good chunk of isps from the mix.
So be it. Please explain why ISPs using non-Cisco gear would expect to see drastically different results, if they had chosen to collect the same metrics?
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anon @ 21st Oct 08:18PM:
bull
some one said The reality is that most people don't need a full throttle connection 24x7 which is why we can have affordable broadband for home use. bull tell the Japanese that crap 100 up 100 down
all about how much they can get and most people believe this shit .....
have a nice day saps......... for caps
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MyDogHsFleas @ 21st Oct 09:53PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by Matt :
It is, but you have to factor in purchasing power and cost of living. 20% of $1,000,000 isn't as big a deal as 20% of $30,000.
the flip answer is: are you math challenged? 20% of 1M is 200K. 20% of 30K is 6K. Last I checked 200K > 6K.
the angry answer is: Have you even looked at the actual stats? NO ONE making 30K is paying ANY income taxes. In fact, the current administration wants to WRITE THEM A CHECK out of the pockets of the taxpayers, in other words, they will have a NEGATIVE TAX. If you try to "tax the rich" to pay for all the current admin's programs, you could raise the rates to 100% for "the rich" and still not close the deal.
Here's some facts: 10% of taxpayers make more than $92400/year and they pay 72.4% of all income taxes. 60% make less than $44,300 and they pay 3.3% of all income taxes. 40% make less than $30,500 and pay ZERO income tax.
the thoughtful answer is: Hmm.. How much more should "the rich" pay? On what basis do you draw the line? There really is no basis, because there's no principle involved. It's just an arbitrary number someone negotiated.
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anon @ 21st Oct 10:14PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
damn it! why can't people today just be happy with only surfing web pages and reading emails!? If it was fine for 1995, then it is fine for 2009! then everyone can guarantee to be below current ISP caps and stop whining about caps.
:uhh:
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tubbynet @ 21st Oct 10:06PM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by jester121 :
Please explain why ISPs using non-Cisco gear would expect to see drastically different results, if they had chosen to collect the same metrics?
the metrics may be the same, but the data outcomes could be drastically affected. again, this is a survey of *20* isps spread across the globe. because of the differences in content, restrictions, cultures, norms, and societal emphasis on technology, it is difficult to put anything into a "cookie cutter". sure, worldwide monthly average consumption is 11 gigs. great. however, that doesn't account for every isp in every part of the country and there is no differentiation between regions of the globe.
while you could make the argument that cisco wouldn't publish these results if they weren't accurate, i contend that the addition of several larger isps in each region and a breakout of each regions monthly consumption would be a better indicator.
q.
--
"...if I in my north room dance naked, grotesquely before my mirror waving my shirt round my head and singing softly to myself..."
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Van @ 22nd Oct 08:19AM:
Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of line
said by MyDogHsFleasHere's some facts: 10% of taxpayers make more than $92400/year and they pay 72.4% of all income taxes. 60% make less than $44,300 and they pay 3.3% of all income taxes. 40% make less than $30,500 and pay ZERO income tax.[/bquote :Considering you are plagiarizing from Fleischer and his talking points, I thought you would at least admit that those figures including payroll figures for the bottom 60% but not the top 10%.
Let's re-write what Ari said in REALITY terms - "A very small number of taxpayers -- the 10% of the country that makes more than $92,400 a year -- earned 40.9% of the nation's pre-tax income in 2005, and paid 54.8% of its federal taxes."
While the share of income taxes paid by the top 10 percent did in fact go up from 2001 to 2005 -- by 7.5 percent, to be precise -- and their portion of the nation's total tax liability rose 9.6 percent over the same time period, their share of the country's pre-tax income went up by 9.1 percent.
»
www.salon.com/politics/war_room/···int.htmlreply
landysaccoun @ 22nd Oct 08:26AM:20GB every other dayI have a client that uses aprox 20GB every other day.
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patcat88 @ 22nd Oct 08:45AM:Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of linesaid by iansltx :
I'm pretty sure that the sample size was big enough that caps weren't an issue. Everyone except mobile broadband providers have caps much higher than 11.4GB.
How do you know what?
quote:
Globally, the average broadband connection (primarily residential subscribers and some business users) generates approximately 11.4 gigabytes of Internet traffic per month.
Did they include every 3G phone with a phone-only data plan, or every 3G device with a laptop/tether plan? Did they include dialup users? What about satellite (WB, Hughes)? What about business grade satellite like Inmarsat? What about WISPs that put 200 users on 1 T1 for backhaul where the speed crawls to 100kbitps during peak usage (still better than 19kbitps on rural dialup)?
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patcat88 @ 22nd Oct 08:48AM:Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of linesaid by Matt :
I've got access to a gigabit connection and a couple of 100Mbps ones. I can't find anything to tax the 100Mbps connection, much less the 1Gbps. There won't be a need for that type of bandwidth to the home for a lot longer than a couple of years, although I'd LOVE to be able to purchase one at a reasonable price right now.
Bluray is 36mbitps AFAIK. With a 100mbitps at home, I can stream content from my home to anywhere on the globe through a VPN. I'll never need to carry a portable HD around every again. The world is my LAN.
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tiger72 @ 22nd Oct 10:07AM:Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of linesaid by anonymoose :
damn it! why can't people today just be happy with only surfing web pages and reading emails!? If it was fine for 1995, then it is fine for 2009! then everyone can guarantee to be below current ISP caps and stop whining about caps.
:uhh:
Damn straight! Everyone, let's mandate we all use Netscape 3.1 again, and host everything on a 20MB
Geocities account with a 100MB/month data transfer limit!
Ahh the good days...
--
"What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning."
-United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamarareply
slckusr @ 22nd Oct 10:56AM:Re: Netflix Trafficsaid by Madtown :
How much traffic does Netflix use on the Instant Watch? Let say I watch a movie that is 2 hrs long.
between that and hulu i think were killing the 11 gb average
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iansltx @ 22nd Oct 11:05AM:Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of lineCisco picked 20 ISPs who were using their equipment. 90% of the WISPs I know of use Mikrotik or similar. You're right in asking what's inside the "20 providers" black box but I'm inclined to believe that Cisco picked wireline or high-speed wireless options (not 3G) for the companies they studied.
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Augustus III @ 22nd Oct 11:50AM:do your dutyI have 3 lines with 3 different ISPs. (cast, att and that other one thats none of your business), along with wireless service for when i travel allegedly capped at 5gb. but i've only gone to 3gb so i can't talk about the 5gb cap on that
my monthly is something like 740gb combined on all the lines. i think next month i'll make it 4tb just to help bump up the "statistics"
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aaronwt @ 22nd Oct 11:54AM:Re: Guess I'm below averagesaid by AstroBoy :said by aaronwt :
but I have over 60 devices that use internet access.
Wow, could you list some of these devices? I must be deprived, I only have about 15 or so. :)
said by MovieLover76 :
60 internet devices?? really?
I have a lot of stuff myself but I don't think I could make it to 60
PS3,Xbox 360, Wii, 3 Laptops, 2 Computers, Xbox, Iphone, ATA adapter, Home Server
This is for 3 people and I can only get to 12
I know it slightly off topic, but how do you get to 60, I'm just curious.
seven Network cameras,
three laptps, one netbook, four desktops, one windows home server, four 360s, two PS3s, seven TiVos, nine HD DVD/BD players, two APs, four bridges, one receiver, three squeeze boxes, three VUDUs, six NAS drives, and I also have ten gigabit ethernet switches. I'm sure I'm still missing a few things. but that is all I can think of off the top of my head.
It's way too many devices but that is waht I have.
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Matt @ 22nd Oct 12:16PM:Re: AVG off 11.4 GB/month shows caps not out of linesaid by MyDogHsFleas :said by Matt :
It is, but you have to factor in purchasing power and cost of living. 20% of $1,000,000 isn't as big a deal as 20% of $30,000.
the flip answer is: are you math challenged? 20% of 1M is 200K. 20% of 30K is 6K. Last I checked 200K > 6K.
My math was right. Who has the better lifestyle, the one making $800k or the one making $24k? And I've made $30k before I my life, I paid PLENTY of taxes.
Here are some actual facts to enlighten you: »
www.taxfoundation.org/news/show/250.htmlThe bottom 50% pay an average tax rate of 14% while the Top 1% pay an average of 22%. Cry me a river. Everyone up to the top 1% pays about the same percentage.
--
"What is conservatism? Is it not adherence to the old and tried, against the new and untried?" - Abraham Lincolnreply
chimera @ 22nd Oct 12:35PM:Re: 20GB every other daySo that's 10GB per day or roughly 300GB per month correct? That puts him in roughly the 99.5th percentile of all users according to this information. So, do you have over 199 other users that use less than him like these numbers would suggest? :)
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anon @ 22nd Oct 03:20PM:Afk pingers without a user don't count.Yeah this whole average thing needs to have an entry amount like it only counts if that user uses least 1gb per month. Otherwise I bet half those averaged in are afk entire month just sending occasional ping packets which drops the whole average down quite a hefty amount. A computer not in use can generate a lot of noise.
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Anonymous_ @ 24th Oct 09:33PM:Re: 11GB is a bit lowi use upto 500GB permonth
depends if i fell like downloading stuff | HD Shows
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cpsycho @ 27th Oct 03:54PM:Usage4 people using the net connection here. On of them is mid 50s, after showing her all the things you can do online, her usage went from 200mbs a day to almost a gig. We are now averaging almost 100 gigs a month now. I bet in two years it will more then double.
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