Verizon's New Wireless Pricing Is An Insult - Again, 'Open Network' Push Is About Nickel And Diming Users
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Verizon's New Wireless Pricing Is An Insult
Again, 'Open Network' Push Is About Nickel And Diming Users
01:09PM Thursday Sep 10 2009 by Karl Bode
tags: prices · competition · business · wireless · alternatives · bandwidth · Op/Ed · telco · content · net-neutrality · consumers · Verizon · Verizon Wireless Broadband
It's been made fairly clear that as Verizon loses the ability to lock down their phones and network (forcing consumers toward their wireless handset content), the carrier is going to make up for it by squeezing the pipe and imposing some steep per-byte charges. A recently leaked Verizon memo gave insight into the company's new wireless pricing plans for Internet-enabled handsets not quite powerful enough to be considered "smartphones": $9.99 for 25MB (50 cents each additional MB) or $19.99 for 75MB (30 cents each additional MB).

If you're a smartphone customer, you can still of course pay $60 a month for 5GB worth of data, but the significant majority of customers are going to be using what Verizon's now calling "Enhanced Multimedia Phones," which come tied to this new pricing. The company this week launched the first phone that utilizes this new, not so bargain basement pricing: the 3.1-inch AMOLED touch screen Samsung Rogue:
The Samsung Rogue will serve as the flagship phone for the company's new data pricing option available to customers beginning today. The new data pricing gives Verizon Wireless customers more freedom to select how much data and the type of data they want to use. . . Customers who want to watch full-length TV shows plus news, sports, weather and live entertainment video clips can also add Verizon Wireless' new V CAST Video on Demand plan...
Except with such low caps and steep overages, customers interested in freely wandering the web consuming video are going to be punished for their curiosity. That's of course where Verizon comes along to direct customers back to their $10.00 monthly VCAST video service. Previously, users who rarely went online could pay (an equally ridiculous) $1.99 per megabyte, though at least they had the option of choosing to not pay if they didn't use the Internet. Heavier users could sign up for the "unlimited megabytes" offered by Verizon's $15 a month Vcast VPak.

Now, data plans for every new Verizon "Enhanced Multimedia Phone" going forward are mandatory. Existing users will be grandfathered, though that obviously will change as they finish out their contract and sign up for new devices.

So what's the motivation? More money for an already very profitable company, silly. Verizon Wireless' second quarter results indicated that wireless data revenue comprised 29.3 percent of total Verizon Wireless revenues (net $3.16 billion in the second quarter alone), and jumped 24 percent from one year earlier. Verizon's already impressive wireless profits are about to get more impressive, and while that's great news for investors and Verizon executives, it's not particularly great news for you, or the generally open nature of the Internet.

You quickly begin to see how Verizon's promise of an open wireless network is somewhat disingenuous and is, as we stated back in 2007, really about nickel and diming users with unreasonable data charges. Verizon's pricing model offers virtually no value to consumers, while the company continues to shove users in the direction of their inferior content offerings. Ever since being busted by New York's Attorney General for pretending to offer unlimited data, Verizon's been looking for the chance to shift to wireless per-byte billing, and that chance is finally here.

Even if per-byte billing is the answer (and consumers have repeatedly come out against the idea) Verizon could have imposed more reasonable pricing. Instead, as Time Warner Cable recently did, Verizon went right for the pie in the sky, imposing pricing that's so out of line with real world costs it has to be considered a slap in the face.

Related:
  1. Product Spotlight: EV-DO Showdown - Verizon vs. Sprint
  2. Google, You're a Wireless Tease
  3. Scott Cleland: Google Using 21x The Bandwidth They Pay For
  4. Verizon's Open Development Initiative? So Far It's A Joke
  5. Google Voice Ban Is Clear Network Neutrality Violation
  6. Real Consumer Group Takes Aim At Fake Ones
  7. What Network Neutrality Is REALLY About
  8. AT&T: Google Is The Enemy Of Nuns
Links: New Topic
Forums »

glinc @ 10th Sep 01:00PM:
Simple

If you dont want to pay this data plan just don't get a "Enhanced Multimedia Phone"

If people want something shiny and new then pay for the cost of it.
reply
wifi4milez @ 10th Sep 01:01PM:
Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

I think my subject line above says it all.
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morbo @ 10th Sep 01:04PM:
was considering Verizon

Based on a recent thread, I have been considering moving to Verizon for their great nationwide coverage especially for 3g. However, I have to reconsider if it is going to cost me such an outrageous amount to do so.
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Jim Gurd @ 10th Sep 01:06PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

said by wifi4milez :

I think my subject line above says it all.
I don't use Verizon. I've been with AT&T since 2003. Originally I was going to go with Verizon until I compared their prices. They were vastly more expensive than their competition and I couldn't justify paying more and not getting more.
--
The Mogambo Guru economic newsletter, an avocational exercise to heap disrespect on those who desperately deserve it.

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ptrowski @ 10th Sep 01:08PM:
Re: Simple

said by glinc :

If you dont want to pay this data plan just don't get a "Enhanced Multimedia Phone"

If people want something shiny and new then pay for the cost of it.
I am willing to bet almost all new phones they release will be now labelled as an "Enhanced Multimedia Phone" if it texts or has a browser.
--
"So, Lone Starr, now you see that evil will always triumph because good is dumb."

Have you been touched by his noodly appendage? »www.venganza.org

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adisor19 @ 10th Sep 01:11PM:
That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

Hope this sheds more light into how locked you are when using a CDMA provider.

There is no escape from the fees no matter what you try. At least with a GSM provider, you could buy an unlocked phone and put the SIM card in it with no worries of being forced to pay extra charges for no reason.

Adi
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TKJunkMail @ 10th Sep 01:12PM:
Re: Simple

said by glinc :

If you don't want to pay this data plan just don't get a "Enhanced Multimedia Phone"
And if you are going to be a HEAVY user of wireless data, then you should get a real smartphone and then get a data plan set up to go along with that.

These enhanced multimedia phones and pkgs are set up for someone who is going to check a score on a sports team or get a weather forecast or look up the address of a store.

For people wanting to watch live video and read their email and check in to Facebook, then bite the bullet and go for the smartphone with the 5GB plan.
--
My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page



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iansltx @ 10th Sep 01:12PM:
Re: Simple

I wouldn't go that far. They'll probably include all messaging phones and all phones with a screen larger than 128x176 though.
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glinc @ 10th Sep 01:15PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

how are they more expensive?? the prices are the same basically, except that att has rollover and charges you upgrade fee every time your upgrade date is due and get a new phone.
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tiger72 @ 10th Sep 01:19PM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

indeed.

indeed.
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TKJunkMail @ 10th Sep 01:21PM:
Aside from cost issues, these 2 Samsung phones look good

Samsung Rogue:
Pic: »www.newscom.com/cgi-bin/pub/s?f=···os084862
Verizon link: »www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/stor···eId=4987

Samsung Intensity:
Pic: »www.newscom.com/cgi-bin/pub/s?f=···os084863
Verizon link: »www.verizonwireless.com/b2c/stor···eId=4986

Look good for texting; messaging(email); & light browsing.
--
My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page


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hotshot187 @ 10th Sep 01:23PM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

These new data plans for Advanced Multimedia Phones is a joke. Most kids these days want a nice phone with a built in QWERTY keyboard they don't want the phone for data or the internet. They want it just for texting. Pretty much all the new phones coming out that have built in keyboards will require a data plan. To me that is not reasonable to charge $9.99 or $19.99 for a data plan on a phone when all they want to do is text. Its just another way to nickel and dime us and its bull. I should have the option for pay per use just like before if I want to use the interent. This are dumbphones not smartphones guys. I do agree all smartphones should require a data plan but making this a requirement on dumbphones is ridiculous. There is absolutely no difference in an LG ENV TOUCH and the Rogue the only reason you don't need a data plan on the touch is it came out before sept 8 date and they want to put these stupid data plans on these phones. Its mind boggling. In a recent memo from vzw is states that these new data plans are going to affect 60 percent of phones in the coming year. So quite a bit and that means I am forced into getting a basic phone like Moto W755 gimme a break if I don't want a data plan.
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bullet087 @ 10th Sep 01:30PM:
Incorrect info

"If you're a smartphone customer, you can still of course pay $60 a month for 5GB worth of data..."

Incorrect. Smartphone data plans are $30 or $45 each (on top of your regular voice plan). It's $60 if you want to legally tether your smartphone to your computer.
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Eat Me @ 10th Sep 01:40PM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

said by adisor19 :

Hope this sheds more light into how locked you are when using a CDMA provider.

There is no escape from the fees no matter what you try. At least with a GSM provider, you could buy an unlocked phone and put the SIM card in it with no worries of being forced to pay extra charges for no reason.

Adi
Most people don't buy unlocked phones and are on a 2 year contract.

CDMA's performance is also vastly superior. For that reason alone I am with Verizon.

Furthermore if they change the contract you can opt out and give up your service.

GSM's air interface is old technology (TDMA) and the coverage with GSM in my area is horrible.

If you don't want CDMA, no one is putting a gun to your head. Enjoy your dropped calls and garbled audio.
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Killa200 @ 10th Sep 01:43PM:
Hmm...

Perhaps just a glitch, but i went through the checkout system at the VZW site for curiosity, and i was able to ad the rogue to the premium and connect plans, which have "Unlimited Data for Mobile Web and Get it Now/Media Center"....
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hotshot187 @ 10th Sep 01:47PM:
Re: Hmm...

the rogue can be put on premium and connect plans
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Killa200 @ 10th Sep 01:47PM:
Re: Hmm...

then whats the big deal over all this?
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duranr @ 10th Sep 01:48PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

said by wifi4milez :

I think my subject line above says it all.
The Problem is that the big 4 seem to collude when it comes to price hikes (TXT MGS?). So even If decline to use Verizon because of this, the other three will eventually follow suit. And It still becomes my problem.
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wifi4milez @ 10th Sep 01:50PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

said by duranr :

said by wifi4milez :

I think my subject line above says it all.
The Problem is that the big 4 seem to collude when it comes to price hikes (TXT MGS?). So even If decline to use Verizon because of this, the other three will eventually follow suit. And It still becomes my problem.
How so? Sprint and Tmobile are considerably less expensive than Verizon and ATT. Then you can also choose from a number of smaller regional providers who offer unlimited calls for around $40 per month. There is absolutely no collusion going on in the wireless industry now; in fact its quite the opposite. I hesitate to call it a price war, however there are many competitive choices on the market today. Verizon is horribly overpriced, pick another provider.
--
Obama = Jimmy Carter part 2
"Secret operations are essential in war; upon them the army relies to make its every move"
-Sun Tzu-

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hotshot187 @ 10th Sep 01:52PM:
Re: Hmm...

alot because there are alot of people that don't want a premium or connect plan. I sure as hell don't. I just use the basic plan 700 minutes $69.99 and $5.00 dollar text option. I don't need unlimited text plans which are 30 dollars more nor the data option.
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Killa200 @ 10th Sep 01:55PM:
Re: Hmm...

eh, i was under the impression that people going after these nice shiny media phones with full keyboards more than likely also used text a lot as well (ex: tech buffs and the younger crowd) so sense would be made to go for at least the connected plan instead of a lower plan and adding unlimited texting, which actually would make it more expensive than a plan upgrade...

Guess your in the minority case...
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hotshot187 @ 10th Sep 01:58PM:
Re: Hmm...

.
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TKJunkMail @ 10th Sep 01:58PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

said by duranr :

The Problem is that the big 4 seem to collude when it comes to price hikes (TXT MGS?). So even If decline to use Verizon because of this, the other three will eventually follow suit. And It still becomes my problem.
Not true. Verizon is the most expensive. They get the best coverage rankings and best call quality and the most reliable 3G. And they charge accordingly. If prices go too high people will leave.

AT&T has the iPhone and people pay AT&T extra to use all the data options. But there are other smartphones out there and people can switch if they feel ripped off. If they start switching AT&T will drop their prices.
--
My BLOG .. .. Internet News .. .. My Web Page



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hotshot187 @ 10th Sep 02:01PM:
Re: Hmm...

I am just saying there should be a choice like pay as you go for data if you want it.
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dfxmatt @ 10th Sep 02:02PM:
Re: Simple

I would say you are very correct, as they used to call any phone with a camera a multimedia phone and still do, IIRC. rebranding, old features, etc.
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hotshot187 @ 10th Sep 02:05PM:
Re: Hmm...

and thats fine shiny new phones with keyboards to use as texting not for data.............
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tubbynet @ 10th Sep 02:05PM:
Re: Simple

said by glinc :

If you dont want to pay this data plan just don't get a "Enhanced Multimedia Phone"

If people want something shiny and new then pay for the cost of it.
the problem is that verizon is essentially limiting what i can and can't choose.
i have a smartphone (iphone 3gs) that work pays for. i use it a lot. i like the phone and the integration with the apps. the experience is much better than on my previous phone (blackjack ii) and the keyboard is a moot point (the blackjack was horrible for my fat fingers).

when i purchase a personal phone (since my employer doesn't mind personal use, but they will inform you if you are using "excessive" minutes), i am not looking for wireless data, watching video, or checking sports scores. i have my work phone to do that. i am looking for a egonomically balanced phone that i won't mind using to send a text to my wife, hold for longer calls with family, and one that could withstand my son getting to it every now and then. i don't want verizon to limit my phone choice by requiring that i *need* a data plan that i won't use. i chose a phone by layout and comfort, not by what it can do.

my situation (while it could be considered unique), isn't that off from a normal consumer. there are some people that just want a free phone. there are some that want the latest and greatest technology. there are also some that just want a phone. for those people, you are saying, you can have this phone to make calls, but we're going to charge you like you're watching video. i'm sorry, but i get frustrated when i can't dial a number because my finger hits the 4 instead of the 7.

it may be "the trend" to have a phone that can do everything, but in following the trend, verizon is pissing off a lot of people.

q.
--
"...if I in my north room dance naked, grotesquely before my mirror waving my shirt round my head and singing softly to myself..."

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tiger72 @ 10th Sep 02:05PM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

said by Eat Me :

Most people don't buy unlocked phones and are on a 2 year contract.
That's because we don't have to deal with the gouging that VZW is doing. If we did, that market may very well change.
CDMA's performance is also vastly superior. For that reason alone I am with Verizon.
In what respect? Voice quality? data speeds? ???
Furthermore if they change the contract you can opt out and give up your service.
Good luck on that.
GSM's air interface is old technology (TDMA) and the coverage with GSM in my area is horrible.
This I can mostly agree with. However, UMTS (which both voice and data run on in 3g coverage areas) doesn't use TDMA.
If you don't want CDMA, no one is putting a gun to your head. Enjoy your dropped calls and garbled audio.
I think you're confusing ATT's horrible network and voice codec choice as a blanket statement for GSM/UMTS. And for the record, I got WAAYYYY more dropped calls with Sprint (using the supposedly superior CDMA interface) than I do (or really ever have) with T-Mobile (using the supposedly inferior GSM/UMTS systems).
--
"What makes us omniscient? Have we a record of omniscience? ...If we can't persuade nations with comparable values of the merit of our cause, we'd better reexamine our reasoning."
-United States Secretary of Defense (1961-1968) Robert S. McNamara

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anon @ 10th Sep 02:12PM:
Good luck!

I get 20% discount for Verizon and I still can't find an excuse to change to them from T-mobile. Their phone offering is a joke and their prices are crazy. I pay 49.99 for unlimited calling and 5 for 300 messages. All I can say bring your laptop and get a internet card. For these prices they should be locked up for stealing.
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en102 @ 10th Sep 02:20PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

On T-Mo/AT&T, you can put in unlocked devices, and not have to purchase through VZW as an expensive process.

Also, AT&T, and Sprint, in my case offer good workplace discounts.

I just never liked Verizon Wireless.
--
Canada = Hollywood North

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patcat88 @ 10th Sep 02:20PM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

said by adisor19 :

Hope this sheds more light into how locked you are when using a CDMA provider.

There is no escape from the fees no matter what you try. At least with a GSM provider, you could buy an unlocked phone and put the SIM card in it with no worries of being forced to pay extra charges for no reason.

Adi
See what happens when your put a non-iPhone ATT SIM card into an iPhone or an iPhone ATT SIM card into a WM PDA phone.
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en102 @ 10th Sep 02:25PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

Yup. I agree. All of these carriers are still GAINING customers (well, except Sprint currently).

You can use Boost, Cricket, Metro PCS, USCC, etc. if you don't like the big 4.

I do feel that this is a little bit like the medical insurance industry though. Its an expensive industry to get into, however, it is also quite profitable, and almost all of the 'big' carriers charge similar.

I have mentioned this before (and it will come true for Cable/DSL, etc).. in the end, someone has to pay for all the 3G deployments.
--
Canada = Hollywood North

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patcat88 @ 10th Sep 02:30PM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

said by tiger72 :

If you don't want CDMA, no one is putting a gun to your head. Enjoy your dropped calls and garbled audio.
I think you're confusing ATT's horrible network and voice codec choice as a blanket statement for GSM/UMTS. And for the record, I got WAAYYYY more dropped calls with Sprint (using the supposedly superior CDMA interface) than I do (or really ever have) with T-Mobile (using the supposedly inferior GSM/UMTS systems).
GSM is ATT if your an American. T-Mobile's coverage is just as tiny and poor as Sprint,
A. 800 (ATT, VZ) vs 1900 (TM, SPCS), 1900 degrades more going through the same obstacle than 800 assuming same starting power and same distance and same obstacle
B. premium carrier (ATT, VZ) spaces their towers closer to give a higher average signal for the area of each tower vs budget carrier (TM, SPCS) that spaces their towers just enough to get 1 or 2 bars to make a call outdoors, and heavily rely on roaming on the 800s, look at Florida, Verizon is 1900 only there, yet nobody ever complains about signal problems there.
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morbo @ 10th Sep 02:35PM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

said by patcat88 :

B. premium carrier (ATT, VZ)
you mean rip off carriers.

seriously, though, a lot of garbage from you in that one post.
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BF69 @ 10th Sep 02:47PM:
Re: Simple

said by iansltx :

I wouldn't go that far. They'll probably include all messaging phones and all phones with a screen larger than 128x176 though.
And that's 100% of all phones. there's not a phone for sale for Verizon that has a screen smaller than that. if you're not using a service you shouldn't have to pay for it. PERIOD.
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BF69 @ 10th Sep 02:48PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

said by wifi4milez :

I think my subject line above says it all.
and if that's all you can get?
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BF69 @ 10th Sep 02:50PM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

said by adisor19 :

Hope this sheds more light into how locked you are when using a CDMA provider.

There is no escape from the fees no matter what you try. At least with a GSM provider, you could buy an unlocked phone and put the SIM card in it with no worries of being forced to pay extra charges for no reason.

Adi
well then tell At&t and the others to expand 3G into my area. Not be 80 miles away.
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wifi4milez @ 10th Sep 02:53PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

said by BF69 :

said by wifi4milez :

I think my subject line above says it all.
and if that's all you can get?
What location are you referring to that Verizon is the only carrier available??
--
Obama = Jimmy Carter part 2
"Secret operations are essential in war; upon them the army relies to make its every move"
-Sun Tzu-

reply
Matt @ 10th Sep 02:53PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

said by glinc :

how are they more expensive?? the prices are the same basically, except that att has rollover and charges you upgrade fee every time your upgrade date is due and get a new phone.
We switched from Verizon to AT&T and saved about $50 a month for the same 3-line 1400 minute Family Plan. It was mainly the fact that AT&T includes the first additional line in their family plan pricing, Verizon does not, as well as the cheaper data plans, usually 50% the cost of a Verizon data plan. That $50 we saved was even factoring in that we added two iPhone data plans, so if we would have stuck with just a single unlimited data plan like we had with Verizon, we could have saved $65-$80 dollars.
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Homer J @ 10th Sep 02:58PM:
Verizon is high for a comparable service

I've been with Sprint for about 10 years now and have thought about a switch to Verizon, but the cost difference for the same level of service was not worth it. I used to have a Verizon phone for work and the coverage was equal in this area. I worked for Verizon Wireless long ago in customer service and remember in training I was asked not to keep bringing up what a rip off their prices were in comparison to Sprint.
I pay $30/month on top of my voice plan for a 5GB of data/unlimted Text/MMS(my phone does not handle it so it is a moot point)/Blackberry service(if I had a Blackberry)/and navigation service. That seems to be reasonable for the service I am getting. Verizon could not offer me anything even close.
I am amazed that they continue to add customers when there are better options out there. Oh well I guess people went for the Iphone too, so there is no telling.
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openbox9 @ 10th Sep 02:59PM:
Re: Simple

said by tubbynet :

i don't want verizon to limit my phone choice by requiring that i *need* a data plan that i won't use. i chose a phone by layout and comfort, not by what it can do.
Choose a different provider. You have a choice ;)
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tubbynet @ 10th Sep 03:01PM:
Re: Simple

said by openbox9 :

Choose a different provider. You have a choice ;)
apparently you've never been to some rural areas only served by verizon.
i have a personal verizon cell because it is the *only* carrier i've used that has worked where i travel (and in my hometown).

believe me, if i could rid myself of the scarlet v*, i would. its not an option.

q.
--
"...if I in my north room dance naked, grotesquely before my mirror waving my shirt round my head and singing softly to myself..."

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openbox9 @ 10th Sep 03:06PM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

said by tiger72 :

said by Eat MeFurthermore if they change the contract you can opt out and give up your service.
Good luck on that.
It's been part of every contract that I've read/signed, so I don't imagine it's too much of a problem.
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tmc8080 @ 10th Sep 03:06PM:
one BETTER!

so, don't like it, dont' use it rears its head again..
I'll do one better.. I call for a TOTAL BOYCOTT of VERIZON WIRELESS --- UNTIL THEY BEGIN LOWERING THEIR PRICES-- ACROSS THE BOARD!!

Capitalism is a TWO WAY STREET.. consumers don't have to spend money.. that's right.. so, when your contract's up cancel, if your out of contract, cancel (EVEN IF THEY OFFER YOU DISCOUNTS, CANCEL!!).. if your thinking about subscribing, move on.. even take prepaid wireless under another carrier..

Taking money out of the carrier's pocket works the best to change their behavior, it works even better if consumers do it en-masse! Just the same way if MILLIONS of loyal Apple customers began buying other brands of Ipods.. Apple's not that stupid to say, goodbye and goodluck-- they'd DO something about it!
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openbox9 @ 10th Sep 03:08PM:
Re: Simple

You're right. I've never seen a rural area only served by Verizon that didn't have at least other local providers. I like my Verizon service. It works where I need it, when I need it.
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tubbynet @ 10th Sep 03:15PM:
Re: Simple

said by openbox9 :

I like my Verizon service. It works where I need it, when I need it.
you're right. it works. its been stable and i've used (older) verizon amps with a 3-watt booster and an external antenna to make a phone call that was over 80miles (straight line) from the tower. could have used 1xrtt but the return path from my phone wasn't reaching the tower. kicked the phone down to amps service and it worked.
all things aside, i still don't like being bullied into a certain plan. but, i guess everyone is different.

q.
--
"...if I in my north room dance naked, grotesquely before my mirror waving my shirt round my head and singing softly to myself..."

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Lenagainster @ 10th Sep 03:16PM:
go to the Connect Plan

Verizon is just pushing everyone towards the Connect or Premium plans.
With those plans, you get a lot more features (unlimited texting, data, IM, Mobile Email, Nav on the Premium plan) for a little more money. And the cheaper stuff is no longer available.

They used to have plans like 60 minutes of calling for $20. Nothing else. Those are gone, too.

You're just getting more stuff for more money, not less stuff for more money.
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patcat88 @ 10th Sep 03:26PM:
Re: go to the Connect Plan

said by Lenagainster :

They used to have plans like 60 minutes of calling for $20. Nothing else. Those are gone, too.

You're just getting more stuff for more money, not less stuff for more money.
Sounds like the right and left hands are finally agreeing on something. VZW and VZ both are on the same page finally. VZ positions FIOS as a premium product, and charges premium prices, same thing with VZW. For VZ and VZW to compete on price would be a race to the bottom.
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openbox9 @ 10th Sep 03:29PM:
Re: Simple

I'm not being bullied into a certain plan, so I don't understand the concern.
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i1me2ao @ 10th Sep 03:37PM:
lg titanium

is the phone i use and do not have all the over priced features. i have fat hands and need a large keyboard to type with. also i am dam near blind and enjoy the larger screen. this reminds me of ford saying oh you want a mustang it must be a cobra because that is all we are allowed to sale you..
--
calling a illegal alien undocumented is like calling a drug dealer a undocumented pharmacist

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clickie @ 10th Sep 03:48PM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

Wanna bet?

This is pretty common in Florida with Verizon.
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cableties @ 10th Sep 03:52PM:
Re: Simple

Most new phones ARE with keyboards, camera, video-capable. This is rape. They figured they could just copy(collude with) the credit card companies by jacking it up and seeing who will still pay, or put their bills on the credit cards!!!
--
Splat

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anon @ 10th Sep 03:58PM:
Re: Simple

»www.mycricket.com/cricketplans/phoenix

Would the 45 dollar plan work for you?
Unlimited talk
unlimted text
unlimited international text
unlimited data
and roam on verizon when you dont have cricket or PEC coverage.

No contracts, no credit.
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jameswade @ 10th Sep 04:02PM:
Re: Simple

Verizon was the only provider around here for a long time. I dropped their poor service and poor coverage as soon as another company showed up. This company has poor service too, but at least the coverage is good.

I'm telling my friends and neighbors and they're dropping Verizon. As soon as the next round of smartphones shows up for the new cell service Verizon is going to lose all of our Blackberry and cell phone contracts

Good going Verizon!
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iansltx @ 10th Sep 04:04PM:
Re: Simple

Not 100%. You can get a basic flip phone from Verizon that just calls and texts, with limited web access. You're just not the target audience for said phone.
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ShellMMG @ 10th Sep 04:48PM:
Re: Simple

I sit between two Alltel towers, love my Huawei EC228 aircard, pull down nearly 2.5-3G on a consistent basis, AND am holding on to their TRUE unlimited internet access with a death grip. I have a year left on my Alltel contract and am constantly on the hunt for an alternative.

Don't mention satellite. Been there, done that.

Sprint won't reach. AT&T barely does and my friends with iPhones can't use them in our house.

Alltel has been very good to me. I'll be sorry when the merger is complete, but I'm crossing my fingers that Sprint's new TRUE unlimited package will put the thumb screws to Verizon to offer a competitive alternative.

Yeah, yeah, I know, I know...
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ShellMMG @ 10th Sep 04:54PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

Uh...that would be me.

I have Alltel now. Not for long. :(
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dib22 @ 10th Sep 05:20PM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

said by adisor19 :

Hope this sheds more light into how locked you are when using a CDMA provider.

There is no escape from the fees no matter what you try. At least with a GSM provider, you could buy an unlocked phone and put the SIM card in it with no worries of being forced to pay extra charges for no reason.
remember... if you require OTA security... CDMA is the only way. gsm is broken and the one that is not is not used by any gsm provider :D

»www.theregister.co.uk/2009/09/04···ecurity/
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KrK @ 10th Sep 05:41PM:
Solution: EMP Bomb

In selected markets :D
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hottboiinnc @ 10th Sep 05:48PM:
Re: Simple

you should have resigned with Alltel and you still can. They're not fully merged yet. Go and sign for another 2 years and have 3 years left :D
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swintec @ 10th Sep 05:59PM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

said by patcat88 :

premium carrier (ATT, VZ) spaces their towers closer to give a higher average signal for the area of each tower vs budget carrier (TM, SPCS) that spaces their towers just enough to get 1 or 2 bars to make a call outdoors, and heavily rely on roaming on the 800s
I thought due to the PCS frequency band, Sprint has placed more towers per area to provide coverage? I read this on Wikipedia rather ecently but can not seem to find it again.
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Gbcue @ 10th Sep 06:00PM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

said by Eat Me :

CDMA's performance is also vastly superior. For that reason alone I am with Verizon.
Good luck on using voice and data simultaneously.
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Eat Me @ 10th Sep 06:02PM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

said by Gbcue :

said by Eat Me :

CDMA's performance is also vastly superior. For that reason alone I am with Verizon.
Good luck on using voice and data simultaneously.
Minor issue for me. I care mostly about call quality and being able to make calls. Being able to make a call, period, is preferable to not being able to do both at the same time.
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Eat Me @ 10th Sep 06:05PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

said by en102 :

On T-Mo/AT&T, you can put in unlocked devices,
Not quite. One of my coworkers bought an iPhone (on ebay) and put the SIM card from his blackberry in it. A few days later AT&T called him and asked him why he was using an iPhone without authorization.

Sure, it's easy to swap out SIM cards, that doesn't give a blanket license to just put whatever phone you want on whatever plan you want.
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Eat Me @ 10th Sep 06:06PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

I have Verizon as my personal phone, and AT&T as a work phone.

Around where I live, Verizon gives seamless coverage. AT&T frequently has dropped calls and garbled audio.

Sure you may save a few bucks, but as they say, you get what you pay for.
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Eat Me @ 10th Sep 06:08PM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

said by adisor19 :

Hope this sheds more light into how locked you are when using a CDMA provider.

There is no escape from the fees no matter what you try. At least with a GSM provider, you could buy an unlocked phone and put the SIM card in it with no worries of being forced to pay extra charges for no reason.

Adi


Incidentally, all you need to do to swap phones on Verizon is to enter the ESN on your online account. It's a quick and painless process. I've done it many times.
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swintec @ 10th Sep 06:10PM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

said by Eat Me :

said by adisor19 :

Hope this sheds more light into how locked you are when using a CDMA provider.

There is no escape from the fees no matter what you try. At least with a GSM provider, you could buy an unlocked phone and put the SIM card in it with no worries of being forced to pay extra charges for no reason.

Adi


Incidentally, all you need to do to swap phones on Verizon is to enter the ESN on your online account. It's a quick and painless process. I've done it many times.
I have done the same with Sprint...bought phones off E-Bay...all no problem. Granted it isnt as easy as with a GSM phone swap.
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sonicmerlin @ 10th Sep 06:23PM:
Re: Simple

Because unlike providers in every other major industrialized country, Verizon is the only "competitor" with quality nationwide coverage.
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nthach @ 10th Sep 07:05PM:
Verizon==Comcast, well almost...

I see Verizon and Comcast as complements of each other. Both have restrictive user policies, both won't let you BYOE, and both are the most expensive providers in their fields.
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openbox9 @ 10th Sep 07:18PM:
Re: Simple

Every other major industrialized country? So you're blaming VZ because they've built a quality network? I'm not sure what point you're attempting to make.
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srvctec @ 10th Sep 07:36PM:
Re: one BETTER!

True, but getting everyone or enough people to go along is always the problem with a boycott of any kind.
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wifi4milez @ 10th Sep 07:45PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

said by ShellMMG :

Uh...that would be me.

I have Alltel now. Not for long. :(
Both Sprint and MetroPCS show full coverage in most of your town.
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jfd15 @ 10th Sep 09:53PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

Dont worry - I dont and never will use Verizon (or AT+T, for that matter)

instead of the colluders i use Metro PCS and get unlimited everything for $57/mo. - no crappy 2-year contracts, nobody counting my minutes, nobody colluding to keep up prices + buying govt officials + reps, and the funny thing is Metro makes a ton of profit off me because i probably use no more than 150-200 min a month and a little bit of web but its worth it not to have some shitty company counting your minutes...

(and they give you a free first month!!!! )
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jfd15 @ 10th Sep 09:59PM:
Re: Solution: EMP Bomb

said by KrK :

In selected markets :D
yeah, like wherever the CEO's of Verizon and AT+T reside...
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Simba7 @ 10th Sep 10:59PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

I have Alltel also, along with my good ol' 6800.

I suck data like a freakin' Mosquito. I operate a mobile computer repair business and I fetch updates and drivers and I can easily eat up 5GB in a WEEK (sometimes in a few days).

I hope AT&T doesn't decide to kill off the CDMA towers just so we *HAVE* to flock to get a new GSM phone and kiss our unlimited plans goodbye.
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BosstonesOwn @ 10th Sep 11:03PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

And guess what , it should.

These providers need to realize we pay for the service , and we should be allowed to use what ever we want on it.

If I was your friend I'd tell at&t to kiss off , I bought the phone and I pay for the service, nuff said.
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anon @ 10th Sep 11:04PM:
Verizon might have a good "overall," network but.....


I swear some people haven't tried other carriers since 2003 but still abide by the fact that all the others except Verizon have zero coverage in every little location they go to ever.

I live in LA. All the carriers work well, more or less.... In my office there are a bunch of middle aged engineers who have the same bias... as smart as they are with routers and switches... they still are very dense and unwilling to try any other carrier because "they heard," all the other carriers suck. This is despite the fact that Verizon has poor RF inside. They just won't hear it otherwise.

Now I know everyone likes to think they have the best service, but Verizon's network is not always worth the extra $40 or $50 per month.
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Simba7 @ 10th Sep 11:07PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

One thing from watching the Bresnan commercials here (with Mr. Bresnan):

"We would be nothing without our customers". Too bad no one else will say that.
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grydlok @ 10th Sep 11:41PM:
Re: Simple

Built or bought?
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veloslave @ 11th Sep 12:50AM:
More Simple

You get what you pay for and if Verizon has to raise prices a little I for one will be sticking with them as I have for many years now.

They are slow and conservative about new technology.

They are more expensive than some competitors

And they have the best dang network and especially customer service around.

Been with ATT... know all about Sprint

going to stay right where I am with reliable/great service
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Fireblade @ 11th Sep 01:16AM:
Re: Verizon might have a good "overall," network but.....

So glad I have unlimited data/e-mail/im with Telus for $15 / month.
--
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iansltx @ 11th Sep 02:04AM:
Re: More Simple

To each his own. Verizon's network is great, no doubt. They're also progressive (not conservative) about their technology path when they want to be. Take LTE, for instance.

That said, I'll take Page Plus Cellular with $40 unlimited talk and text with 20MB of data over Verizon's own otions, unless I really have to have LOTS of data...
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patcat88 @ 11th Sep 02:07AM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

said by swintec :

I thought due to the PCS frequency band, Sprint has placed more towers per area to provide coverage? I read this on Wikipedia rather ecently but can not seem to find it again.
You will need more towers if you have a PCS network (which also means small cell sizes, which means less congestion/faster speeds on each tower), but you can built a PCS network the cheapway to provide the 1 bar outdoors in most places, or you can build a PCS network the right way to provide 3-4 bars outdoors and 1-2 bars indoors.
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veloslave @ 11th Sep 02:29AM:
Re: More Simple

I agree with the progressive as long as you consider that they are usually the slowest to market with devices due to rigerous inhouse testing... making guys like me very antsy waiting for the new dope :)
--
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iansltx @ 11th Sep 02:39AM:
Re: More Simple

They are rather slow with phones, but network techologies are a whole different deal...
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veloslave @ 11th Sep 03:29AM:
Re: More Simple

True... first to have 2.5G and 3G and with real penetration

CMON LTE !!!

(can you taste it?)
--
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openbox9 @ 11th Sep 05:45AM:
Re: Simple

Both.
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tiger72 @ 11th Sep 08:34AM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

said by patcat88 :

said by tiger72 :

If you don't want CDMA, no one is putting a gun to your head. Enjoy your dropped calls and garbled audio.
I think you're confusing ATT's horrible network and voice codec choice as a blanket statement for GSM/UMTS. And for the record, I got WAAYYYY more dropped calls with Sprint (using the supposedly superior CDMA interface) than I do (or really ever have) with T-Mobile (using the supposedly inferior GSM/UMTS systems).
GSM is ATT if your an American. T-Mobile's coverage is just as tiny and poor as Sprint,
A. 800 (ATT, VZ) vs 1900 (TM, SPCS), 1900 degrades more going through the same obstacle than 800 assuming same starting power and same distance and same obstacle
What does this have ANYTHING to do with CDMA/GSM/UMTS?

Oh, and btw.
1. for 80million customers, T-Mobile and Sprint's coverage seems to be enough.
2. Check out that ATT coverage map a bit closer - their native network is closer to Sprint's size than VZW' size. VZW has the biggest native network - by far. ATT doesn't come close. Their coverage maps are just conveniently vague on how much you roam.
3. ATT's network is an 850 AND 1900 network.
B. premium carrier (ATT, VZ) spaces their towers closer to give a higher average signal for the area of each tower vs budget carrier (TM, SPCS) that spaces their towers just enough to get 1 or 2 bars to make a call outdoors, and heavily rely on roaming on the 800s, look at Florida, Verizon is 1900 only there, yet nobody ever complains about signal problems there.
Holy idiot believing the advertising, batman!
Are you serious or just trolling? So, you're saying that in florida, VZW is 1900 (which they aren't), T-Mobile and Sprint can only get 2 bars outside (i can upload a picture of me getting 5 bars INSIDE pretty much wherever I go), and that ATT is a "premium carrier"?

Either you're full of shit or a you have got to be trolling. No one can really be that ignorant.
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tiger72 @ 11th Sep 08:36AM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

said by swintec :

said by patcat88 :

premium carrier (ATT, VZ) spaces their towers closer to give a higher average signal for the area of each tower vs budget carrier (TM, SPCS) that spaces their towers just enough to get 1 or 2 bars to make a call outdoors, and heavily rely on roaming on the 800s
I thought due to the PCS frequency band, Sprint has placed more towers per area to provide coverage? I read this on Wikipedia rather ecently but can not seem to find it again.
This is correct.

BECAUSE Sprint and TMO use 1900 band, their towers are spaced more closely together.

Because they have to space their towers closer, they can't spend as much on rural coverage. That's why TMO and Sprint's rural coverage is generally quite lacking.

ATT and VZW have better rural coverage because they can (and do) space their towers further apart thanks to the 850 band.
--
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Eat Me @ 11th Sep 10:40AM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

said by BosstonesOwn :

And guess what , it should.

These providers need to realize we pay for the service , and we should be allowed to use what ever we want on it.

If I was your friend I'd tell at&t to kiss off , I bought the phone and I pay for the service, nuff said.
He did, but they told him they'd shut him off or bill him for an iPhone plan.

As for paying for service - not quite. The phones are sold at heavy subsidy and you're paying for the cost of the device essentially on a 2 year installment plan.

So yes, you can swap SIMs in theory, but in practice the carriers still want control over what device you use.
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Eat Me @ 11th Sep 10:42AM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

said by wifi4milez :

How so? Sprint and Tmobile are considerably less expensive than Verizon and ATT. Then you can also choose from a number of smaller regional providers who offer unlimited calls for around $40 per month. There is absolutely no collusion going on in the wireless industry now; in fact its quite the opposite. I hesitate to call it a price war, however there are many competitive choices on the market today. Verizon is horribly overpriced, pick another provider.
Yeah but in the case of Tmo and Sprint, you get less coverage. Sure you will be covered on major roads and highways in populated areas, but out where I live coverage is spotty.
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Eat Me @ 11th Sep 10:43AM:
Re: Hmm...

said by hotshot187 :

I am just saying there should be a choice like pay as you go for data if you want it.
That option went away years ago with smartphones. What you are seeing now is that policy being migrated to multimedia phones.
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JesusBeamz @ 11th Sep 11:23AM:
Re: Verizon is high for a comparable service

VZW "Connect" plan is the same as the Sprint "anytime anymobile" plan - both w/ 450 minutes and the same $69.99 / month .. except on sprint you can call any mobile phone regardless of carrier and verzion is to verizon only
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Acuity @ 11th Sep 11:26AM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

Is Sprint really all that bad? Unfortunately I just signed a new contract with Verizon a couple of months ago but after my contract is up, I'll be looking elsewhere.

I look at Sprint and see contracts where I can pay $49.00/month and get unlimited text messaging. I can also get a Palm Pre and use the wifi for data to check my email while at work instead of paying for a VZW data plan and then $5/month for email.

Sprint struggled when it merged with Nextel but the price might be worth moving for. I just wish those SERO plans were still going on when I re-signed up with Verizon.
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wifi4milez @ 11th Sep 11:57AM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

said by Acuity :

Is Sprint really all that bad?
Sprint is fine and they have good pricing.
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TKJunkMail @ 11th Sep 12:02PM:
Re: Dont like it? DONT USE VERIZON...

said by Acuity :

Is Sprint really all that bad?
It all depends on where your live, just like with all wireless carriers. For me and the mostly mid-atlantic states where I use my cellphone, it works just fine. Inside the house was sometimes shaky coverage, but I got Sprint to give me an Airave femtocell for free and coverage inside the house is now excellent. I never get dropped calls and never have problems connecting. And Sprint roams on Verizon's network for the few times a Sprint connection isn't available.
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Gbcue @ 11th Sep 01:40PM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

Yes, T-Mobile's rural coverage is sparse, but you go to any city/urban area, 5 bars.
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heatsker151 @ 12th Sep 06:43PM:
Re: That'll teach you for using a CDMA provider

I get the warm fuzzies every time Verizon tries to pitch me a new phone credit (last I checked, I could get all but five of their phones free, and the rest would have cost under 50 dollars) Not gonna happen. I don't think I've seen data charges yet :)
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dunworkin @ 13th Sep 12:48PM:
Re: Verizon might have a good "overall," network but.....

We're glad too.....
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thorataz @ 10th Nov 11:50PM:
Damn thats crazy.

My total Sprint charges are 65 a month. Unlitmited any mobile, text, pic and data. I use about 800MB per month. All providers make money on data
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